No Chill with Yahya and Simu

Listen to this episode

S1: Yeah, yeah. Trailed his fingers across the edge of. I followed his hand with mine. SIGHING softly Everything here is yours, he said. Just ask.

S2: Oh, that’s all right. I like it. Trailing fingers, don’t we all?

S3: Don’t we all miss. I miss the trailing fingers situation while.

S4: Pillow’s lightless, we wanted to take a moment and say thank you once again for your membership and support, which has become more important than ever, especially in times like these.

S5: You’re helping everyone at Slate do the work that they do and we’re doing our best. Put out the best work for you.

S6: Now, if you’re a reader of Slate as well as a listener, you might have heard that Slate.com recently installed a paywall. But as Slate Plus members, you have access to everything on the Web site. As long as you’re a member, you will not hit a paywall. All you have to do is sign in as slate that com slash log in that slate, dot com slash log in. And if you have any questions about your account, you can email us at plus at Slate dot com.

S7: I feel like the longer this goes on, the more suggestive beginning hellos have become practically Harry like, hey, Lou.

S2: Man. We are like, well, you’re like my most consistent voice contacts each.

S8: We hardly touched. So I feel so sad for you.

S9: I mean, of course, I talk to my mom and my sister. But obviously, I’m not gonna like purr at them, you know?

S10: Nicole. What’s wrong with your voice? No. Completely right.

S11: I have it if I go buy some hay. Well, I won’t be late.

S3: I’m too lazy. Lazy anyway. Are you okay? Even though I am your consistent purring voice in your ear?

S12: No.

S13: You know what? You know what you sound like, what you say that you remind me of that Bugs Bunny meme.

S14: His mouth is open. No, I pinched out a very emphatic no.

S15: It’s just, you know, it’s hard thirsting when you aren’t stuck in the house all the time.

S16: I mean, it turns out like I’m like a plant. I need sun, I need air, and then I need cross pollination and shit.

S17: I don’t know. It’s kind of like I think about it now that I become a Salvado wanker. I think about the basic idea of, you know, something I’d never, ever considered or thought about wild yeasts in the air. It’s something I had never contemplated in a real way. So to see the flower and water become a thing. I kind of be like, ha! So it was there all along. I just had no need of it. I didn’t I didn’t know I required it. You know, and I think I am likening this like a true brooklyn-based idiots. But I am. But I am likening it to the idea of wild years. I think many of us need to go out and get some of that world used without even knowing that it’s there. And now that we’ve been denied it, it’s kind of like, oh shit, like I didn’t even know I needed this thing to make the thing. And I feel like just trying to be to feel full enough to put something out there that feels complete and human and right.

S18: Is very difficult if you’re not doing a lot of the stuff that makes you human, which is being in the world and some in some tangible way. And that doesn’t necessarily mean walking outside or being outside. I think, you know, but it but it does add to it.

S2: So, yes, big adjustment period. Yeah. And to keep going with this sour dough thread. It’s you know, when we are exposed, there are things that we can discard in order to make it better, in order to keep the process going. And we don’t have the ability to discard much right now. And so we are just settling into this muck that is going to be ruined somehow because we’re just absorbing everything we can’t discard. What what needs to be tossed away?

S18: That is a reasonable way to do it. Although I will say, Nicole, once we’re free again, I am gonna make you some discard crumpets.

S19: They are really quite special.

S3: That sounds so provocative and I don’t mean it. So discard corrupted my best hay fever voice. Oh man, those fuckers.

S20: We just wanted to let you know that next week’s episode will be our last for a little bit. We’re gonna go on hiatus like we did previously.

S17: Yes, just a little hiatus as a treat, as the kids say. Just so that we can, you know, hunker down and hopefully replenish and refresh, as we mentioned, about the sound of starter metaphore, which got out of hand. I feel like we need to do a bunch of discard recipes and build up a stronger, hungrier. Oh, in this case. Thirstier starter. So, yes, we are going to be going away for a little while. But remember, you can always access all our past episodes, which includes interviews with people like Chris Evans and Blair Underwood and Wilson Bethel and Charlie Cork’s. It’s just it’s it’s a cornucopia of treats and it’s all there. All you have to do is go to slick dot com slash podcasts and you will find us there. You can also go to our Tumblr where we will be. So I don’t know, hopefully posting as we replenish. And you can always keep an eye on our Twitter as well, which is Twitter, dot com slash, just a kit. And yeah, we’ll be back before you know it.

S18: But we do need to take a little break. And we are we are sure that you understand and support us because you always do. Thank you. First buckets.

S2: So we do have a good episode for you there.

S3: We hope you like after all that talk of how we call this discarded, because I got right on with the show, but we’ve gathered for you.

S10: That was that was a terrible way to lead it.

S21: We do have, I think, a stellar we have two two amazing first objects on the show this week, much like we did last week. And I feel like that’s a good way to kind of get through the spirit. Were bundling or bundling our first objects to kind of, you know, see see what else they might be able to offer us. And I’m actually quite pleased that we’ve been doing this, Nicole. I don’t know how you feel about this, but this week we have two stellar first objects and each brings something very specific and at the same time, something very general that I think in these times where we need, I think, more comfort than usual. They are delivering on that front.

S22: Yes, we’re talking about simul Lu and Yahav. Abdul Mateen the second.

S23: And of a woman named Zoho. Yes.

S24: And we’re going to kind of continue something a little thing that we started with our last episode when we talked about she’s outlived Steve and many Montana, but we’re going to talk about some men that you should have your eye on for many reasons.

S2: But, you know, we want to get a little bit ahead of the curve and let you all know that these are the people you should be watching from here on out. We told you first. Okay, maybe like second or third.

S25: I don’t know, but it’s so beautiful.

S2: But pay attention, because we are never wrong on this front.

S16: You said it. You meant it.

S26: Yeah. Yeah.

S27: To my team, the second name of royalty.

S21: So can I just say you start that very much with your sticky issues voice. And I’m intrigued to see why you’re gonna go with this. Why do people know what we mean when we say my sticky shoes?

S2: You know what? I don’t know. I feel OK. So that is a friend’s reference stick issue.

S28: My stake is take issue.

S29: Why take me back?

S2: So she was really liking her voice as she wrote this song. She wrote and prepared this song about her sticky shoes. It was ridiculous. Everything. Yes. So every time boom and I get sick and we have a deeper voice, we just refer to it as our sticky shoes.

S30: Well, if I was that amazing somewhat. Thank you, Nicole. No, please carry on in idiotic issues. Voice talking about yo yo, Abdul Mateen the second.

S2: Oh, OK. Now, I was born in New Orleans and he was raised there for a little bit before his family moved. I think they moved to California at some point. But I knew without even knowing that he was from New Orleans, like he had like this this sheen about him because he has such a peacock attitude about himself. This man loves to preen. He loves attention. And it is such a New Orleans man way that I just knew it instantly. Like, it’s just all about all over him. And, you know, I don’t know how to explain it. Beyond New Orleans, men have the confidence. I have never seen anywhere else in the United States. I’ll say that.

S30: I’m so glad you added the caveat in the United States, because when I look at Yo-Yo without a shadow of a doubt, I’m like that man is several percentage points Nigerian.

S21: Like he he reminds me of no fewer than six uncles of mine who are just kind of like, listen, if God didn’t want me to be pretty, I wouldn’t be prissy.

S2: Yeah. Yeah. Is not afraid of color.

S3: With his little beautiful, dark skinned people, he’s going to bring it.

S2: I look good or bad. You can look through his Instagram and you’ll see that he has posted like images of him in this very hot pink suit. Dislike. I was a hot pink is like a hot fuchsia. I don’t know, but it’s like magenta. Yeah. Nice. And it looks so good on him. Oh, my God. He is not afraid of patterns. He does. He he wants you to look at him and he will wear whatever it is that will make you look at him. And sometimes that means just his skin.

S31: Oh, listen.

S2: And he has suits fit very well. I don’t think I’ve ever seen him in an ill fitting suit since, you know, he’s become a person of note, shall we say. That’s actually been fairly recent.

S24: Like his his star, like just started maybe like in 2015 when he landed a role on Netflix is the Getdown Rights.

S17: That was the show by the creator of Romeo Plus Juliet and Moulin Rouge, amongst other things. Basil, Lemon and Ya-Ya played a character, Nicole Cadillac. The whole series is kind of set in the disco world. And it’s he’s he’s a very as he can’t help it. A very beautiful and charismatic and just gorgeous character in there. And I haven’t seen all of the get down because like many people, I was I think the idea was better than the execution. But God bless everyone. But what I did see, I really, really liked him. Like he has presence in a way that really kind of commands your eye. So I feel like a lot of people didn’t really.

S16: See him in terms of just like sheer numbers until a couple years after he did get down because he didn’t get down 2016/2017. Right. And then a couple years after that, he was cast as black manta in d.c.’s Aquaman. And that for me was the first time that I watched like a project like Beginning to End. And I was like, okay, here’s the character, here’s an arc and this is who he is. And the thing about Aquaman is it’s trash.

S9: It’s so not good.

S3: But like, it’s not because the people in it aren’t like powerhouses in their own right. Like this fucking Oscar winners in there. It’s got Willem Dafoe on like a sea horse kind of horse. Like it’s got actions that pieces is doing way too much and all of it quite badly. But yeah, in it.

S17: And he plays, like I said, black man’s as though he’s the villain in. And his father is played by Michael Beach too, is like this villain who I don’t think is a spoiler to say he dies early on. And so. Yeah. Yes. Character David Slash Black Manta has to kind of avenge his father. But also he’s like an amoral, I know. Mercenary type. So it’s I mean, like I said, the movie’s bad anyway.

S2: Yeah. I was in the movie and he actually taught himself how to swim, huh? Yes. For this. And he tells us in a CONAN O’BRIEN interview with the entire cast, but he tells us a little bit about how he taught himself how to swim for this movie in Australia.

S32: And this the first day that I get there, the first thing I do, I go to the sporting goods store and I get I get some like Olympic goggles and a kit board. And I’m taking it very seriously.

S33: And I’m downstairs secretly learning how to swim almost like floaties supposed to have floating the.

S32: I mean, it was on 4ft, you know, and there was no talk of floaties. It was like two weeks ago my dog got my cape water.

S33: Let’s get to work eventually.

S32: You know, long story short, I teach myself over the course of a couple of weeks I get better and better, take myself out of swim and then we get to the set. Lo and behold, I don’t have to swim in the movie swimming.

S2: Now, I admire the fact that he taught himself how to swim in a two week period because it took me years to get up the nerve to be like, OK, I’m going to learn how to swim. And I’m still not a strong swimmer, but I’m fresh for sure. There he was like, no, I need this skill. I could do this. I admire his dedication to making that happen. And unfortunately, like you said, there was no need for him to learn how to swim.

S34: I can’t lie. That’s kind of hard to be like.

S2: Yes. Yeah. Termination Schitt’s. Yes. And I think that’s just kind of how he seems to tackle everything in his life. Like when he was in college, he went to UC Berkeley. He studied architecture. He became a city planner for San Francisco. And when he was laid off from that job in 2010, he went to Yale School of Drama. Yeah. You know, cause he he got the acting bug when he was in college. I think he was he was running track. And they had to put on, you know, a little sketch for each other, like the undergraduates, for the grad students or something like that. And so he was doing these sketches and people kept complimenting him and they were like, you know what? I wanted to go take some acting classes. It’ll be fun, blah, blah, blah. And he did. And then once that, you know, situation happened, he went to Yale School of Drama and then from Yale School of Drama. We get to see him on screen now. And so it looks like he just once he gets something, an idea in his head, he goes for it. And I appreciate that drive, because it makes me think that, you know, maybe he’s focused and determined elsewhere in all parts of his life.

S3: Little pause was the hardest working pause in the show thus far. You know, you just let the brain fill up with all sorts of thoughts.

S21: You know, at the top of this show, we were talking about how Hollywood has been kind of very, very slowly, as is the way with these big things turning its gaze away from the traditional beefcake, whatever, like, you know, representation. I hate that word in this context, but it’s very slow and it’s not even on. A lot of it feels like one step forward and six steps back, etc.. But what I’m excited about with this new crop of young, I’m not so young, but just like new actors is this idea of how much they bring to the table. That’s never been in doubt. To be fair, but I think they’ve been a lot of them have the opportunity to do more. So you’re not. Not so structured anymore where, you know, you’re in you’re a character actor or you’re a leader. You read this. And I think a lot of that is down to the superhero movies, which did a weird thing of sorts of creating so many more roles for any number of actors. And yet somehow managed to get the lion’s share, as is always the way to a bunch of white actors. And what I’m interested in is something like, yes, Aquaman, which, like you said, trash, but still it exists. That’s great. And it made a fuck ton of money. So again, there’s gonna be a sequel. I have no doubt. But it’s just like widening what is possible. What I like about yoga is that, yes, he’s playing this kind of like I said before, scenery chewing, you know, bad man. But he’s funny and he is like he gives like pathos and he gives you emotion and he does soft on. He does big and he does I like. There are so many facets to him, unlike what I like about him, because what I saw when I saw Aquaman, I was like, Jesus Christ in heaven, how can we remove this from my memory banks? But then I watched another great movie which had moments. Baywatch. Yeah. Yes. In it, he plays like this cop and he is so funny.

S18: A very small clip from Yahaya just who is like this frustrated police officer who wants to do his fucking job. But these Baywatch idiots keep coming in and undermining him. And, you know, doing way too much. And I just really love the scene. 5 foot 9 Pied Piper right now.

S35: To not contaminate my clients. You don’t give me any of that juristiction shit. Oh, no, I won’t. Because technically you don’t have a jurisdiction lifeguard. You got one job. Make sure swim happy. White people don’t drown. Technically, that boat out there is the Coast Guard’s jurisdiction. Okay. And if I would’ve waited for them, all these girls to be dead, we would have diverter.

S36: Chris. I’m not ready to die.

S35: I know. You’re not. So technically, we saved lives. Technically, I see a dead body which technically makes this a crime scene.

S37: Hey, technically, these technically are wasting a lot of time, technically. Thank you, blue eyed demon.

S3: I see the way he delivers that line. Thank you, blue eyed demon. It makes me crack up every time. I was watching it on my laptop. Once he said that, I burst out laughing. I rewound it. I screenshot it because I feel like it’s gonna be a very useful reaction. A photo to use on Twitter. It is just so funny the way he and he’s funny like that throughout the movie.

S21: He’s so frustrated and annoyed by these musclebound idiots. But I just like I love him in that movie. Like the whole movie I could throw away, but I would pull wholesale. His performance, which cracks me up in a very simple, pleasurable way. He’s so funny.

S2: He is funny.

S24: He recently went on his EITI life and was I am going to draw some of ya.

S2: And so people he would just like randomly picking people to join in. And so he would pick somebody and they would join in his life and he will look at him. All right. Okay. Uh-Huh. You know, he’s doing this and he turned the picture around and it would be like a stick figure.

S9: A little squiggles all over something.

S2: And, you know, he would try to add a color, like if they have this one woman, she had red hair and so he like did some kind of weird maroon in her hair or whatever she was like. You made me look ridiculous. He was like, oh, you got some bad to say. And he just, um, you know, just disconnected her from the like.

S9: But, you know, it was all in good fun.

S2: But he was so, like, silly and is playing with everybody. And it was you know, sometimes he gets a little flirty with people, you know? Yes, he does.

S19: I’ve known idea. You know what? You see him do that.

S17: I always think to myself, God, if he did that to me, I think I might just like I’d log off. I’d be so overwhelmed. I can’t imagine having the beam of his attention. I don’t know. It would make me. I don’t know. I’d have to get off a logo.

S19: Sorry. He’s so potent.

S2: Yes. Because, you know, he posts are these thirst traps on his Instagram. And, you know, as a three strapping, you’re just like you’re like. Yeah. Yeah, I do. Come on.

S9: For real. But you’re also like typing out a comment like, oh, what’s up, daddy? You know, I just felt real, like, learn it if it is straight up a trap. You are leard into it, eh? Like this guy. It’s disgusting. It’s disgusting. There’s one I think he’s sitting in first class somewhere and he was just like, where is she? Like talking about his mysterious V-1.

S30: The comment was so out of control that he will literally just kind of be like, yes, this is a photo specifically of my Adonis belt. Say something. And without fail, everyone is going to like.

S3: OK. Any idea has my best work. And it is a stream. Nay. A river? No, an ocean of filth that just follows through. I’m reading through that, but I am laughing so hard all the time, crying because especially women like there were so many people out underneath those comments, people of all sorts of gender and sexual expression, just like saying what they say.

S21: But I find personally that the comments from black women are inventive.

S3: They are hilarious. They are disgusting. And they are just so pure. Like these women that they want nothing from him except the purpose of set this trap and the like. All right, cool. Let’s dance. It’s kind of weird. Wow.

S2: And. Knows what side his bread is buttered on because he knows that black women that are going to boost him to a point where he’s probably not gonna meet us anymore and then we’ll forget about us.

S8: But, you know, what will we do next?

S2: But he knows that in order to get to that point, he needs us. So I have this little clip wrong.

S38: I mean, this is what is important. Listen to black women because they think they got the answers straight up. I mean, I don’t have to. I don’t have to elaborate on that. But they’re right. And they have the answers, period. Listentome are you won’t go wrong. Never steered me wrong in my life. Never will.

S2: So, yeah, yeah, yeah. I knows that black women will lead him to the promised land, whatever that may be for him. And he represents as we appreciate that. And I think also, you know, we were talking about superheroes and how, you know, Hollywood is kind of changing the way that they approach superheroes. We cannot talk about ja ja without talking about Watchmen. Oh, okay. Well, then let’s talk about Watchmen. Full disclosure, I have not seen the whole season say so. I think it’s like the only season because I think they decided that they don’t need they don’t have any more story to tell.

S16: I have seen every episode in those single season of Watchmen except the last one, which apparently has the big well, maybe the last two. So it has the big reveal that I don’t think is a spoiler to say at this late stage in the game that reveals Yahaya as a pretty pivotal character in the Watchmen law and be long before I even saw any part of it because I wasn’t watching it when the rest of the country was watching it. I remember seeing my timeline go nuts, a very specific wild.

S2: It was wild.

S17: I mean, I felt like the earth move beneath me and I was like, the fuck is that an earthquake in Brooklyn? And then I went on Twitter and I was like, Oh, no, it’s the fire in blue body paint and absolute total May, Kitty. And I realized what it was that had discombobulated the earth beneath my feet.

S2: Everybody was talking about that appendage and.

S39: I don’t judge language was pendejo about.

S2: I was just like. I mean, of course, I want to watch the show anyway. But again, you know, you kind of have to be in the mindset for certain things. Right. And so I was like, okay, I need to get my mind right to watch this so that I can get to this payoff because I need to see that whether it is real or not. I can put together my own, you know, composite imagery in my head of what what’s really happening.

S21: That whole season, I had watched him and he was like this beautiful, just this character that I couldn’t take my eyes off. Because the thing about him in Watchmen, you know, he’s playing the husband of the Regina King character. He is beautiful. He’s so supportive. Carl is like very much like they are such goals. If we’re gonna be kind of insanity about it and I feel like in this role, it gave me something of his character that I hadn’t had the chance to see before. The writing was amazing. The acting around him was fantastic. And I think it made him just kind of be like, you know, well, let me do my work. It is really one of the most beautiful, nuanced. Like, it’s just one of the best things I’ve ever seen on TV.

S2: Really? Yeah.

S24: You know, we’ve talked about the pleasure in watching someone’s skill set grow as an actor. And I think that’s what we’re we’re gonna see with Ya-Ya and particularly when Candy Man, the horror film comes out. It was originally scheduled to come out in June of this year. But because of the different shut downs, it’s been pushed to September, I believe. And so this is a sequel of the famous Candy Man story, and it is directed by Nia de Costa, written.

S2: Yeah, co-written by her and Jordan Peele. And it is it looks it looks so good that I, you know, famous scaredy cat thought about seeing this for like five minutes.

S3: But I know that I cannot because save you. Mia, love you both desperately want you to have all the amazing success that is due to you. But I’m gonna have to sit this one out. But I love you. I will read the Wikipedia summary. All right. That’s the most I’m gonna do.

S2: Right. So I think, like what you said with, you know, Regina King pulling for this incredible performance from him. I think having near the Costa and Jordan Peele there will help pull out some amazing performances from him, you know, because I think horror does not get the respect that it needs when it comes to people’s acting sometimes in certain films. You know, like most people have to cut their teeth on horror in order to get into Hollywood. But there are some incredible performances that you could find in horror. And I I would not be surprised if you performers, just from what I’ve seen in the trailer and what people have been talking about is one of those performances that kind of goes down in horror history books.

S18: Wow.

S17: That is a beautiful, beautiful hope and prayer, because here’s the thing for all of the noise about his clear, incredible beauty is also just someone who I think wants to kind of leave that mark in their profession that they’ve chosen at an advanced age. He didn’t he’s like some kid who’s been like tap dancing since he was six, like this came to him. He’s working for it. He’s getting it.

S40: And I really hope that his career just unfolds over the years to come, because I think he’s very special. I agree fully.

S17: OK, Nicole. So we started the show with the idea. We went a little bit wild because he does tend to inspire that in an inner lady or anyone, to be honest. But when I’m going out, we’re going to move a little bit. We’re going to we’re going to Khazar gaze to another up and coming. Truly can’t take your eyes off him kind of guy. I’m talking, of course, about similarly, he’s so adorable.

S2: And also, you know, in the same way that we talked about Ya-Ya is kind of a P Kaag and does all these starch traps. simul is the same way. Like he has no shame about himself, which is fine. You should not wyhe. Right. He puts out these little videos of himself on his Twitter and Instagram.

S41: He is fine as hell.

S21: I mean, I listen, this is first aid kit, we talk a lot about physical appearances alongside all this other stuff, of course. Right. But every so often there is a face that is so arresting that you start doing that uncontrollable giggle.

S3: It is kind of like, oh, that’s your face. Are. Like just. It’s it’s not something you can control. It just comes right from your diaphragm.

S17: It’s just kind of like all this is taking pleasure at symmetry in the world. That’s why I would smile at a perfect a perfectly shaped tree or the way I look at a really wonderful mango. And I’m like, oh, that shit looks juicy as hell. Like just as as a basic fact, the fact of Simos face is just like, oh, it’s pleasing to me.

S22: He is.

S2: He’s funny, you know, he doesn’t take himself too seriously. So he’s able to poke fun at himself. I think this is just what I’m seeing from like his Twitter presence and social media presence. But he is just I wouldn’t want to hang out with him. I don’t want to go to a bar and just like chill with him for a little bit. Not even on some like come home with me later kind of stuff, which is like flat out. Let’s go hang out and just chill.

S17: Right. He has the vibe. He he looks like a good time boy. And I don’t mean that in a sexy way. I mean, it isn’t very much just kind of like let’s spend time laughing and joking. And like I can imagine him, particularly in the summertime, I can see him in like a beer garden. I can see him in a park. You know, he acts like the kind of person who is born for the outdoors. And you guys would just have a laugh the whole time. And that is also the older I get and the more I want to sit down, the more I think to myself, well, who’s going to sit beside me?

S42: And like, I want people who seem like they are good company and they are funny and they are kind and they just seem to be engaged.

S16: Like there is a thing that I have noticed in all of the interviews and he’s been doing a lot more interviews, of course, for reasons we’ll get into. One of the things in his interviews is he does this thing where he has he he maintains a really remarkably engaged listening face. So he doesn’t look like he’s bored. He doesn’t look as though he’s waiting for you to finish so he can talk. He doesn’t look as though he is literally got like a list of answers and whatever he says, it will make sense somehow. He always looks like he leans forward and that really small, subtle way. But lets you know a person is involved and he does that thing where he has like a smile on his lips. So he’s kind of like what I’m hearing you. He nods, but never too much, just enough.

S21: And then when it’s time to speak, he refers to your question. He refers to points you’ve made. He just seems, again, wild projection here. But you know what? You can see someone engaging with you as a human being. Yes. That shit is hard. I’m sorry. Yes, it is. And the bar is underground. I say this. I admit it freely. But it just feels like when a person treats you like a human being, shockingly, that shit feels nice.

S2: We’ve heard so many different celebrities over the years talk about how they know that these interviews are just selling themselves. And sometimes they just kind of, you know, check out a little bit and they’re not fully engaged. And also they’re saying the same things over and over again. Right. So they’re not able to really, you know, bring their personalities fully into some interviews sometimes. But it seems like Seymour is just like when you have somebody who can sit there and repeat the question back to you, you know, folded into their answer so clearly and so thoughtfully. It’s just like no worse. We’re still on the same level. Like just because you’re interviewing me does not make me a better person than you. We can still have this good conversation and it can go from there like there’s just so exotics.

S31: Oh, it’s hot.

S3: Nicole, it’s nice to see you.

S2: Yes, yes. And yes, the bar is underground, but these things still count for something, even with the bar being in hell.

S3: One of the things I enjoy also about Zimmer is the pure pleasure that he is.

S16: He understands that right now is a really purple patch for him and he is happier than a pig in shit like he is.

S19: Yes, sir.

S21: It’s great. My life is great. Like I don’t think you understand. Like he has been. For one thing, he did that thing which can be cringy and or effective. And in this case, it clearly was. But he has been asking Marvel for literally years.

S43: Yelling, Hey, hey, hey.

S3: He’s basically the annoying K. Tapping on the shoulder, going, excuse me. Excuse me. And he did that shit for literally five years. And the answer was. Guess what, bitch. I’ve now been costs as Xiang. So, you know, up. It works both systems. Oh, I listen.

S17: You know how much I hate when people at celebrities on Twitter, especially if they involve me, I’m like, please. I know how to act someone. Don’t do it. In this case, he was in them himself. I know he wasn’t kind of good. Hey, guys at Marvel until then to cast me. He was doing the work himself, and I respect that. Huh? My God.

S2: No, he’s like he knows what he wants. And he went after it. And you can not do anything but respect that. And like. I really like that. You said that he recognizes that he is in this purple patch because that’s what makes it endearing and that cringy that he is so thirsty. A little bit, because he knows that everything is fleeting. He knows that he’s not going to always have his body around. You know, he knows that he’s not going to be a fucking superhero in a Marvel, you know, franchise. He knows that. And that makes perfect sense. Let’s be present. Enjoy today and go from there.

S19: Because that’s all we have is today, as as we have learned through all of this stuff like that, it ended with an existential crisis. We have learned. Okay. Call me. Oh, sorry. This looks like it started to weigh heavily on everything now.

S3: But I will listen. So, Tina, it drives me everywhere you look.

S2: I finally started watching Kim’s convenience. Would you have told me about four years? And I just was like, oh, I’m going to put it at my Netflix queue and I’m gonna get to it. And I finally started watching it. This man’s face is the fucking sun.

S39: What? OK.

S3: So what you told me you started watching it. I didn’t. I released a breath. I wasn’t even aware. I’d been holding like, finally, this bitch, like, you say it. You hope people take any recommendations in their own time. Of course, everyone has lives and whatnot. But then when you started it, I don’t know, a weight was lifted off because I might listen. I love the comedy of the show. Obviously the comedy is top notch.

S17: I love so many of the like the lines, some of the line delivery. You can tell there’s just like perfect synergy between the writer and the performer. I love so much about it. I love the ease with which the characters embody themselves. It’s just it’s lovely. But yes, the first time he plays a character called John and the first time I saw him.

S31: Michael. You don’t.

S17: Why did you do a stereotypical double take? Yes. Like, I literally I think I said out loud, Walt’s like the bar for this remains limonov Miranda looking at money is into. I’m going.

S15: Come.

S3: But that’s not far away from where I was. Like, I saw him when I was like, wait a fucking minute. This dude is just in Canada just walking around.

S19: Right, that’s going on. Why do I need to go to Canada again? Like what is happening? What is happening?

S2: His character works at this car rental agency. So he’s in a uniform and he has to wear this robin’s egg blue shirt. That is beautiful.

S8: So his. Oh, my God.

S30: I got good looks good in that color in a polyester fucking shirts and simply said, actually, I’m gonna look amazing in it. It’s gonna upset all the undertones in my skin brilliantly.

S34: Oh, my God.

S2: And the lighting, of course, is like, you know, it’s very bright sitcom lighting.

S41: And he was just so upset that I waited so long to watch him.

S2: The camera, like the first time, the camera, like, you know, sets on his face.

S19: I my wife is so upset with how beautiful this woman was. Nicole. Oh, my gosh.

S2: Because he has this like, really kind of sweet, caring look on his face because we first see him, he’s talking to his sister and then his boss comes in and his boss says is clear, awkward crush on him. So he kind of has like a little pity on her. He takes a little pity on her because he sees that she’s trying to, you know, put some moves on him and like, no, baby, it’s not gonna happen. But he still is kind to her. It’s all there in his face.

S34: And I’m just like, wow. Come see about me.

S39: I mean, it’s just.

S2: I think that that is you know, I don’t. I haven’t seen him in very much. But I think that just that the way that he is able to mix the pity and kindness in his face when dealing with this woman that has a crush on him, that is a job well done.

S34: It’s so profound, there’s that little bit of work in the sitcom. Boy, you better.

S17: So I believe that’s when I actually fully felt in love with him, is how he deals with his boss because. On the one hand, you think, oh, they’re about to set her up as a sort of buffoon.

S16: She’s gonna be like a sort of Michael Scott, a sort of. You know, Leslie Knope in season one kind of idiot, kind of a buffoon. Right. And then as the show progresses, you will see she kind of changes and crucially. So there’s Joan and it becomes like this more equal thing. But I think in that first season where she is clearly like most of us, I guess, would be overwhelmed by his beauty and what looks like a lot of charm.

S30: And every time there is a softness in his face when he’s kind of like, oh, my God, poor kid, like he never looks like he pierces her. It just looks like he sees her and he understands her battle because, listen, he has a mirror. He knows what he looks like and he’s gonna like irises. I want to help you out. I’m just going to be as human and direct as I can be. I really love the show. I think it’s incredibly funny. Mrs. Kim in particular is fucking amazing.

S18: But the thing that I love about it is that it is widening the idea of what families look like on TV and in particular, especially for symeou for him. There was something really great, he says, about playing a son in this kind of family.

S44: So, I mean, I was introduced to Kim Screening’s through the through the play outside in the winter of 2015. And it’s really the first time that I’ve ever seen my story told onstage with such an incredible experience, changed my relationship with theater, because up until that point, going to theater was almost like going in the museum. You know, it was like, oh, this is wonderful. I like the costumes. They’re very nice. People talk funny, but I never really saw. I never really thought that it could be like a transcendent experience where you could like, you know, learn about yourself. While watching these characters on stage was a truly incredible moment. And it made me think about my relationship with my own parents. And you know, those of you guys listening who have grown up in immigrant households, well, we’ll know. But, you know, when when you’re when you share a house with with people who grew up in a completely different time with completely different values and, you know, oftentimes speak a totally different language, there’s just going to buttheads. You know, there there’s gonna be moments where you disagree. And, you know, that’s putting it very lightly, of course. And there’s feelings of resentment that come out of that as a child growing up, because, you know, you, for example, I never wanted my parents to pack me a lunch that was, you know, ethnic because I was always getting made fun of for my smelly lunches. I never you know, I always wanted to go to sleepovers and I always wanted to invite my friends over. My parents didn’t love doing that because they were always anxious about their own English speaking ability and they didn’t want to embarrass me or themselves.

S17: And I think the other thing I really loved about that was the the widening of the lens away from just himself.

S18: So when he talks about how as a kid he didn’t want his parents to pack him, you know, a lunch that kind of indicated that he was, you know, Chinese.

S17: I think there is something, even if you never had that. I think there is a classic thing that happens for all children of immigrants where, you know, you’re different. And I love that he acknowledged it. And I think exactly right. It’s exactly Argin, I think thinks of his parents like these people who want to curtail his fun, who have been too harsh. Meanwhile, Mr. Mrs. Kim, a kind of like now we work that way because guess what? You fucked up, right? And we reserve the right to be angry. You dont get to dictate how we treat you. Just like that. If you’re gonna do bad stuff, we’re gonna react in a bad way. Like I just I love the relationship between them. I think so often the urge is to shy away from stories that quote unquote look negative. But I really actually love that journal. Mr. Kim, do not get on. And it’s not played as a sort of like this deep seated, you know, stern Asian culture is just kind of like sometimes sons and dads are just dicks to one another. We’re just gonna play this for them being dicks in another. It’s not like some weird one I’m going to read when I’m gonna make this an orientalists. Fucking weird way to look at this family. Not not in this not in this particular scope. I think there’s something really just refreshing about that. I hesitate to put things like it’s powerful and blah blah, but I think it’s just refreshing.

S2: Right?

S45: I think there’s so much to be said for being able to play a role that speaks to you.

S2: And part of your identity, that is not a stereotype and that is not, you know, someone trying to do some colorblind casting as well, you know, because so many times I think people of color, they get put into Shakespearean plays and, you know, they’re just supposed to play these people that have no connection, that they have no connection to, and then they get offered stuff where they are. The delivery driver of, you know, the Chinese restaurant or whatever. You know, stuff like that. And there’s like no in-between for them. So to see, you know, work like Kim’s convenience. Always be my baby. Fresh off the boat. Things like that where people are just playing people playing themselves, they still speak to them, but still like show. The diversity of their experiences is as you said, it’s refreshing.

S24: And I hope that we keep seeing more and more of that. Whether it is lucrative to Hollywood or not, that we just need to see. We need to keep seeing these stories and all the different ways that they play out.

S2: So I’m seeing Kim’s convenience. Watching it is just not only because simul is beautiful to behold, but this is just really funny. Good show and I am definitely going to finish watching everything that’s online about it because it’s so, so good.

S30: There is one scene in particular that I really love, which is when his housemate, a best friend Kimchi, has a girl coming over for dinner and he doesn’t want the girl to even glimpse junk because he knows that if she sees him, he’s going to like chopped liver. Makes a little. It’s very shallow. But I respect what kimchi is coming from. He’s like, listen, I’ve been friends since we were kids. This shit is going to not work out in my favor. So I just need to just hide yourself.

S18: Anyway, John comes home and of course, naturally the date sees him and everything has changed. Anyway, let’s have a little watch.

S46: What are you doing here? Sorry I had to work late. I’ll be on 10 warns. What are we up to? Out. I have to shower. Smart baby bird. That’s adorable. Just breathe. That worked for you with your library. He’s. Hey, come through, right through. In fact, I was thinking we could spend the next 10 minutes or so out on the balcony. Just came from outside. Can you see me? See? All right. So what can I get for you to go with my mortadella white wine? You just luck by the big box. Oh, hi. I’m a roommate, Sean, who’s just leaving. Well, I have to get dressed first. But it’s nice to meet you. You, too. I’m Lauren. That is so. It’s a pep dress. I’m doing a bit of a meatball. No, I am polio. Yes. Shay body butter. Of course it is. I love that stuff. Well, I’m gonna get changed. I’ll see you later. While junk seems nice, does he always walk around half naked at the front? Think of him as half dressed. Ham and cheese or broccoli and cheese.

S3: First of all, can I just say a small note of appreciation that he uses the show? Okay. Yes. Yes. Hi, guys. I need for all of you to lotion up. Can I just throw that out there free of charge. Thank you so much.

S2: Yes, it’s funny. He recently tweeted a video. You know where he was supposed to be showing us what his at home Marvel workout is? Yes. I still love him cause he’s like, you know, he stretches he’s got the dumbbells there in front of them. He stretches and then he goes to pick up the dumbbells. But then he sits down and just like grabs a bag of chips, the estates eating chips. So he has a sense of humor about him, which I really appreciate. And it seems that he is multi-talented. I don’t know how much he sings like in his filmography, but he recently posted a video on his Instagram of him.

S47: Singing and harmonizing with himself was like this before the fearful fall in a major lift, the baffled king composing.

S48: He.

S49: Watch. I’m sure I’m the show.

S2: I love it again. You know, he’s kind of showing a little bit of skill and then he’s gonna embrace the humor and let you know I’m not taking it seriously. This is just this is a little something, a little something for you.

S3: He does that thing that very prissy people do. It’s the kind of cut the tension of how attractive they are. It’s kind of like I’m just fooling. I’m just I’m one of you. I’ll go.

S20: Well, I’m so glad that I finally started watching Kim’s convenience. I feel, you know, this has made this self-isolation a bit more tolerable to look at someone so beautiful and watch something so funny and delightful. And it has prepared me for work. Similarly, you will do in the future. Man, you know, between simul and Ya-Ya, changing Hollywood in, you know, in such a short time period as well. You know, Yagiz, you know, he started in like 2015. See, Moules started around 2012. There’s still very much babies and they have so much career left in front of them. And we’re we’re just getting started with them. I can’t wait to see what happens next. For both of them, because hopefully they’ll be around for a very long time.

S17: That is my fervent hope. I also hope that somewhere in the long, industrious futures, they kind of discussed a little sideways glance and see first aid kit and be like, hey. Alex, interesting. Why do we allow them to interview us? I’m just putting that into the universe.

S2: Listen, I second it.

S3: I’m going to make it. We’re going to make it happen. Yeah, I guess so.

S17: Nicole I trust in us. I feel like we’re gonna we’re gonna mount a very silent but effective campaign to get all of our faves onto the show because we deserve it. And so do they.

S2: Everybody just come on the show. Let us talk to you. You know, you need to diversify your interviews anyway. Right. Just come on the show. We’re going to talk about whatever you want to talk about. Going to keep it light and fun. And it’s gonna be great. And we’ll just get to look at you for a little bit or even, you know, just listen to your beautiful voice. We’re not picky.

S18: That is the most amazing invitation I’ve ever heard. And if I were, for example, Somalia or Yahya Abdul Mateen the second, I’d be like, hey, that sounds like a good time. And I would get my people on it. Just saying that just I’m just this purely objectively speaking, this sounds like an amazing podcast, but you want to be on. So come on down.

S27: All right. Are you ready?

S3: Nicole, I was born ready. I said that. I don’t believe that’s all. I’ve actually the opposite of ready. I’m a mess on the floor. I’m still primordial. I’m just. Yeah, let’s do it. Let’s power through, buddy. How are you?

S2: I don’t know what this fanfic war is gonna look like, but, you know, we’re here and we’re ready to battle. Oh, okay.

S8: I don’t know. I’m trying to hype as backup. I’m sorry.

S3: I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to laugh. Your effort. You’re right. We’re here to do what? Battle. Okay. We’re back on track. Nicole, do you want to go first or do you want me to go first? How are you feeling?

S15: I go first. Oh, okay.

S3: I love what you offer. Because I know you got like a fucking six bullets. You know exactly where they’re going.

S25: So let’s hear it.

S30: First of all, sorry. How are you doing? Your rebel Ava? Yeah. Yeah. I’m shocked. Wow. I’m shocked.

S50: Okay.

S22: I found Ya-Ya in the middle of a master closet dressing room, suit, jackets and ties and handkerchiefs tossed carelessly over the chase. He stood in front of the mirrored wall, barefoot in black dress pants. He looked at me hopelessly when I walked in. This is my first red carpet where I am the unequivocal lead. My name is first. I gotta look good, baby. He said to me as he gestured to the mess around him, Ya-Ya was nervous. A rare experience. The premiere was out for another week and he’d already decided on one suit. But there he was, preparing contingency plans. I sat on the chase and talked him through a few selections until he stood in front of the mirror, wearing a deep, honey colored brocaded jacket that pulled the son from his skin. He rolled his shoulders to make sure the cut was proper, and I felt the sparking heat rolled into my belly. I stood and walked the short distance to him as he turned and watched his reflection from multiple angles. He unbuttoned the jacket and posed for me, smiling at his own silliness. I pretended like I was going to tuck in his shirt, but instead I unsnapped his pants.

S2: Hey, hey! He protested around the smile, but I remained focused on the task at hand.

S22: I cut a glance at the reflections around us, and rose to my tiptoes to kiss along his jaw. You’re going to be so good, baby, I whispered to him as his hands went around my waist. Just watch.

S3: You know what, I love Nicole.

S17: You disregarded the fact that stars like Yahaya get fittings with like stylists with, you know, entire rails of designer stuff. You just said, fuck it. He has a designer railings and the stylists right here in his bedroom. I love that. I love that journey for you. I love it.

S2: You know, that’s what fantasy life is all about.

S17: So we’ve got an bsod at times who you know, I think that, you know.

S2: Yeah. I like to look at himself in the mirror. So I wanted to. Yes, he does. Yeah. Put that into my drabble some kind of lovely way.

S17: He decided to honor his his method. I see. They call that research, Nicole and I love research.

S2: I try. I try. I’m so glad. What’s your travel for today? Who were you? Who were you writing about?

S3: I thought I could do something with the idea. But it kept descending into the kind of like R-rated shit. So I pulled back. I just. Every time I tried to do something, it was kind of like, you ever watch that show?

S17: Episodes with a parody of Patrick Stewart has all these stories and they all end with. And then her clothes fell off. It’s ridiculous. But that was that was basically me. I was kind of like a square in a supermarket. Right. He picks up some fruit and then his clothes. No, no hold. So I had to pull myself back and kind of be like, what are you doing here? So I decided instead to write Drabble about Zimmer. And again, sort of, you know, the slight peacocking thing we spoke about people who were really awful and like fun. And I kind of wedid in the fact that it seems like he likes to sing. And this is what I ended up with. I apologize. It is a little bit long, but I’m going to do my best to make you not feel that way.

S1: All right. All right. I’m ready. As soon as it was suggested, I could see the light in Simos eyes light up.

S18: This is an activity that was becoming increasingly rare. So many of our friends in the same city as us at the same time available and almost desperate to hang out. It had been ages since we’d been out like this even longer, since we’d let loose a time before new responsibilities at work and babies and other life shenanigans, but now, replete with pleasure after a big dinner with close friends or caught up in our group gossip. Karaoke was somehow the finest idea anyone had ever had in the history of ideas. We spilled out of the restaurant jacket slung over our arms, slightly tipsy, pupils dilated, which made affections second nature out on the street. I took myself under Simos arm, molding myself into his side, thighs aligned and met his still sparkling eyes. I already know what you’re gonna sing, he said with a knowing smirk. I was predictable. A bunch of Whitney hits delivered with more heart than skill, plus Prince’s most karaoke friendly offering kiss to close my sit. What are you gonna sing? I deflected his answering grin, was open and boyish cheeks flushed. He was having a good time, I could tell you, straight to hand over his jaw. Oh, you’ll see, he said in a voice he usually reserved just for me entirely predictably, my insides briefly turned to mush, some to. I was several bottles and way too many butchered classics. Later, we had all begun to show signs of flagging. But first it was Simos last time on the mike, as a machine called up his choice. He turned to me where I was half sitting, half lying on our friends, and stretched his arm out like I was a lucky girl at a rock concert. Tinny guitars with the backing track started up.

S51: Looks like we made and he sang. Look how far we’ve come, my baby.

S18: I laughed out loud with bright pleasure, and a few moments later was swaying tip silly into him, yell singing Shanaya together, the microphone useless between us or Lewises sleet.

S2: Cause you know I love the prince. Shout out.

S3: I did that for you because a it is my karaoke go to. But also I thought, you know who’s gonna love this? Michael. Yes. And I do. Yay! I love it when I get it right. Thanks to God.

S2: Oh, that was really cute. I like that. Thank you very much. So their thirst buckets. What we like to do is let you marinate in these travels for a little bit. And then on Friday, we’ll post a poll on our Twitter account Thursday Kit, and you can vote for which one you like better. And, you know, it doesn’t really matter because we’re all winners. There are no losers here. We’re. We do this for fun. We do this for you. We do this because it’s it’s nice in life. It’s a good way to work out some of our aggression.

S52: I love it.

S2: But we still want you to go to our Twitter at Thursday kit and vote for which drabble you liked the better. And, you know, yeah, it’s gonna be up there. You can either have Ya-Ya in front of a mirror getting naked in many different ways. Or maybe you like sumo serenading them in a drunken karaoke session. It is. It’s up to you. The choice is yours.

S17: The choice is yours. You sound like Captain Planet, and I love it. They call another sterling job on the rebels. I bowed to you respectfully from a distance of far more than six meters, because it’s a pleasure, as always, to do such gentle battle with you.

S2: And it is my pleasure as well. I’m so glad that we get to do this together, even though we are far apart.

S15: And you know, it is a highlight of my week. So thank you. I’m crying. Cry.

S53: First, eight kids is a slate production produced by Chef Vincent and us. They will meet Nicole Perkins. Our music is by Tanya Morgan.

S27: You can follow the show on Twitter at first aid kit. And we’re on Tumblr at first aid kit podcast that Tumblr dot com.

S53: There’s new episodes every Thursday, but you can also in life tweet. You’ll listen anytime by using the hashtag Blackbaud. That’s t Так p.o.d.. Or you can send us an email telling us all your favorite bits at first aid kit at Slate dot com.

S27: Arthur Similarly, a service is open for business to send us a short message and we do mean short no longer than a minute. That number is 5 1 0 9 8 4 4 7 7 8. That’s 5 1 0 9 first non-u.s. Those buckets can send us a short voice. Note the email to Thursday aid kid at Slate dot com.

S53: You can find all of our episodes and links to listen at Slate dot com slash podcast. And if you find yourself wishing you could get even more Thursday, get content every single week. Good news you can. All you have to do is become a slate plus member. Slate plus is Slate’s membership program for just $35 for the first year. You’ll get a little extra from this show as well as all of the slate shows. Plus, absolutely no ads. Visit Slate, dot com slash first aid plus to sign up.

S27: We’ll be back next week. Please continue to wash your hands. Stay home. And remember that Salvado starter may not be necessary. You could also learn to crochet. Learn to knit. Maybe just read your favorite book over and over and over again until next time. By.

S2: You know that show the Teletubbies, right? And they have that little baby in the sign that comes out and my calms everybody down. That’s how he was to me, like I saw him.

S39: And I thought, that is a deep cuts.

S54: Welcome back to late members. Howdy. Hello again.

S2: We are here today with a very special guest for a very special edition of Explain Yourself.

S30: A put some notes. Even though we are calling this segment and explain yourself, I have to just put my hands up in complete and utter surrender because I actually fancy this person. So this is not so much of a mission for our guests to bring me on. I just want to put that on the table for the sake of clarity. Oh, yeah.

S2: I say I go in and out, loll about my attraction to this person. But we are going to talk today about Channing Tatum with the fantabulous, fantastic Roxane Gay Hierarchs. And hello, ladies. Roxon’s work has appeared in so many places such as Best Sex Writing, 2012 Anthology, McSweeney’s, Tin House, Oxford American artists were everywhere that you can imagine. She’s a contributing opinion writer for The New York Times. She is the author of multiple award winning books such as A U.T. and Untamed State, The New York Times best selling, bad feminist, best selling, difficult women. And again, New York Times best selling hunger. She is also the author of World War Konda from Marvel Comics. I mean, that’s not even including all the stuff that she has coming out soon. Roxanne, welcome to Thursday. Kick the Slate Plus edition. Thanks for having me, guys.

S3: How are you today, Roxann?

S55: You know, say say, you know, like I try to pretend every day and like, keep a good attitude up because in general, I’m fine. But also, like, if I allow myself to think beyond today, then I’m not. So, you know, I’m fine.

S3: That’s the voice of a whole globe. Yeah. Fine. The show. Great. Why? No, I’m here. That’s that’s a solid. That’s. I feel like everyone has like a stock for answers. We just kind of like put them on a cycle like what will today be. Okay, Joe. I’m great. Everything’s fine.

S56: Nothing to panic about here. The world is coming to an end, but it’s all good.

S2: That’s all good, right? Exactly. Yeah.

S17: Well, we hope that for the next several minutes at least, we can bring a little bit of more joy and a bit more pleasure for people because. Yes, like we said, we are gonna be talking to worksand today about her noted her amazingly, amazingly scholarly record of Bansi Channing Tatum. Now, some of you don’t know I don’t know how, but we’re excited is a bright light in terms of ways of thinking in the world. And I feel like in as much as she has contributed so much to literature and the arts, for me, her legacy will forever be stamped in an amazing legendary review of Magic Mike 2. Now, if you haven’t read this, I urge you to pause this right now. Go to Google. Just type. You know that at the minute you start typing after you type in Roxane Gay. Are you right? Chan it’ll come up. And once you read it and come back and press play and listen to the rest of this because it is a fine work, I feel like it should be submitted years late to the Pulitzer committee for some kind of years late reward. It is truly one of my favorite bits of critical writing. It is absolutely stunning as a work and personally we could end this right here.

S57: I just wanted to say that the and space that I feel I cannot disagree. Bautista It’s true. I mean, fuck the books, whatever that review of Magic Mike 2 is. Honestly, the only thing I’ve ever done that matters and finding I. That’s a fine legacy. Excellent. Excellent. Okay. Well, on that note, I feel like the only way is up. So what is it about?

S21: Channing Tatum, that speaks to you so Roxanne.

S55: Well, I have to say I’m from Nebraska, so I grew up around Cornfed men and I know where you grow up and that aesthetic oftentimes in, you know, it imprints upon you.

S58: And so that certainly imprinted me in terms of like what I like in a man. I like them big and thick and sort of, you know, this blank canvas onto which you can project your desires. And so, you know, he’s just so thick and juicy, but he can dance and he’s got a sly little smile. I just but he can dance, you know, anytime.

S55: I’m overly impressed when a white person. Because they’re mostly without rhythm and so bad at dancing.

S58: So that like when one person can find the beat, it’s just a miracle. And so I think I do give them a little too much credit for that because, you know, the bar is so low. But, you know, that’s a big part of it. And, you know, I think when a man can dance, generally, he’s good in bed. And so he just has that. And I can really. Do it. I can lay it down.

S55: Well, not every man gives off that vibe. Like a lot of men, you look at them and you’re like, you don’t know what the fuck to do down there. And that’s upsetting. But when you look at him, I just feel confidence. Like like a sexual Boy Scout, if you will. Oh, my God.

S2: Yeah. Do you remember?

S24: Do you remember the first time that you saw Channing and what your reaction to him?

S59: The first time I saw him was probably in step up to the classic of American Idol lutely. Before that, this was before he was like as famous as he is now.

S58: But he was just so great and he was just dancing around the scream. And I just was delighted. And then I saw him and she’s the man.

S57: And yet they’re not saying what it’s all the band is or isn’t. Yes. Oh, no. I’m a cinema expert like criterion collection. No, thank you.

S14: I have to be honest. I feel like she’s the man is top three Shakespeare adaptation. I just have to say that it’s really amazing.

S58: Really, is that. And clueless and probably 10 things I hate about you.

S17: Exactly. My list. Amazing. We are of one mind.

S56: Yeah, it’s a nice trifecta. And so I just really enjoyed seeing him because he’s at least back then. He wasn’t necessarily the greatest actor, but he had charisma. And you just you know, again, you could project on to him. You could just imagine whatever you needed him to be. And that’s what celebrities are. In fact, they were there. You know, they’re real people. But to most of us, they’re not. And so their projections and their idealized and that’s OK. It’s totally healthy because I do understand the difference between fantasy and fact.

S36: Fact. He’s hot.

S3: Q E D? Yes. Okay.

S2: I love how confident you are. And in this fact that he is had he is.

S55: Is also he smells like a pine forest so.

S3: Oh my God. Oh my. Yeah. OK.

S2: So let’s talk about that. So part of you know, you have been recognized as being a, you know, in love with this man as much as one can be. And so some kind of way that got to him and y’all met. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

S56: We’re working on a project together. And he I don’t know, actually how he. Oh, I think it started with an Australian journalist who mentioned that I have a fondness for him and that I’m a feminist. And I wrote a book called Bad Feminist. And what did he think about feminism? And he said the right answer, which is, I’m not an expert in that. I shouldn’t speak to it, but maybe I’ll check that book out and the right answer, not involving my book. But just, you know, like don’t speak on things you don’t know about. And right then. Some time later, my agent called me and she said, Are you sitting down? And I said, Yeah, OK, sure. And I thought she was going to say something really bad. And she’s like, Channing Tatum wants to work with you. And I said, Oh, okay, sure, whatever.

S55: And I thought it was a really because it was around the time of my birthday. So I thought it was a really elaborate joke. And so up until the day of, I was like, my God, my friends are awesome. They love me so much that they’re doing like this ridiculous thing. I got an address and it was, you know, in Los Angeles and I was driving further and further up and into the hills. And I just thought, huh, man, my friends are really cute. Like, this is great. Like, it’s so real. Like, I’m so excited. They’re all gonna be waiting for me at the end of this journey.

S56: And so I pulled up to a house and then standing on the front balcony of the home was my prince.

S33: It was real. And he greeted me himself.

S37: He was a delight. And then we talked for two hours and agreed to do this project.

S3: You can’t see what want a cigarette?

S36: I mean, you have to wait. So what did you say? He smelled like home first. And I don’t hug anyone. I think hugs are a crime. And he hugged me and it was fine. I was just like, Daddy. Let’s go. Yes.

S3: This is better than any trouble I could ever write. This is beautiful. And there are, you know, know. Right?

S36: Oh, my God. We were talking he was like wearing sweat pants. And he was so terrible. And I was just like, oh, Jesus Christ, I just want to crawl over there, but I’m not going to. He’s married. I’m gonna be so good right now. I was also in a relationship. But that’s neither here nor there. He’s on my list. And like for the first time in my life, that, like, magical list worked out like, holy shit.

S21: Anyway, I just wanted I just want to remind people the title of the review that you wrote for Magic Mike XXL in the Butter was.

S23: And I think about this often. I wanted to hug every part of him with my mouth. I do. And I feel like that is such a specific and clear line of thoughts like, oh what what do you think about this person? And the answer is, I wanted to hug every part of him with my mouth. It’s just a beautiful. I just wanted to put that as a full stop to you talking about, you know, being a fan of hugs. And yet there it is.

S60: I’m a fan of oral hugs, for sure. Oh, my God. I meant April woman right there. No problem.

S36: I will hug you all night long. I will hug the skin off of you.

S61: Let’s analyze this. So let’s. Okay. So he is from Alabama.

S2: Mississippi. He was raised in the south and bayous and things like that. So when you were talking to him and he was probably fairly relaxed. Could you hear more of his accent, more of a southern accent? That’s just my. Oh, I just. This is for my edification. And I just want to.

S56: Oh, no, not really. I can’t say. But he did talk about where he’s from. And like the southern boy is alive and well in him, I must say, in a good way. That’s that’s a compliment, not anything else. And, you know, just like really he’s in my experience and, you know, I don’t like meeting celebrities because more often than not, they’re just complete trash. But he was genuinely kind and open and he surrounds himself with good people, which not every celebrity does. And I just you know, he’s just seems like a really good guy. And I could be wrong. But I have not only had positive experiences with him and he insisted on equal pay for our project and not every person does that. But it has to come from like the famous person. And generally, it has to come from the man or the white person. Otherwise executives aren’t gonna do it. And he I didn’t even know about this. I found out after the fact. And I just think that people who do that kind of thing and don’t expect recognition for it, like, that’s awesome.

S23: Mm hmm. Well, I went from a place of deep fancying into just like really incredible respect. Got chatting.

S59: I got Channing. He’s a friend. He really is a prince. He is a prince. You know, the thing is, everyone’s human. And I’m sure he’s got all kinds of flaws. But I don’t need to know about them because I’m not his partner. I’m not his girlfriend. I’m not his wife. I’m, you know, like it’s great.

S17: That’s great. That’s basically Thursday. It’s kind of like, listen, we can talk about all the bigger, wider issues as well as how. Pleasing somebody is to look at, but ultimately, let’s not forget that we don’t know everybody that we’re talking about. And even if we do, we know them how we know them. But it’s still lovely and reassuring when something is confirmed. Perhaps even an opinion. You didn’t even know that you held. And then all of a sudden, it’s kind of like, huh? I was right. I sense something good in you and you’ve confirmed it. And that’s nice.

S56: It’s always nice when your instincts are affirmed and it doesn’t happen, I think, for most of us that often. So when it does, you know, I don’t take it for granted.

S2: So to go back to magic, my magic Mike. And from my understanding, there’s not going to be a third one, I think. Channing said he said what he wanted to say, LA, whatever. But what I wondered, do you think that his work with bringing his story, basically this, you know, this kind of fictionalized version of his own history?

S24: And do you think that that has helped him break down any stigma about sex workers and being able to move on from sex workers into different careers?

S56: I would like to believe so, but I suspect that the majority of sex workers would say that it has not broken down any doors for them. I think that it broke down doors and destigmatize it for him. But more often than not, that isn’t the case, which is deeply unfortunate. There is very little ability to crossover. I think that once someone is stigmatized as doing sex work, they’re not allowed to move to move beyond that. But at least the conversation was opened. And for a small moment in time, I do think that people were more open to the idea of exotic dancers and, you know, men doing this work and also having something of an interior life, which is not something we really see a lot.

S62: Right? Right. Yeah. I’m thinking about people like Cardi B in Black China.

S24: People like that that, you know, even though they’ve moved on and they still have a fairly public facing career, it still gets tossed into their faces.

S2: Oh, you’re just a stripper at the end of the day. And clearly, Channing doesn’t get that kind of vitriol tossed at him in the same way. So obviously, there’s some, you know, some gendered bias going on in regards to race and gender.

S58: Play a huge part in it. I think that if you’re a white at least a white heterosexual man and you have money, at least presently you get it like people will for forgive or overlook anything.

S56: Not that I think sex work should be forgiven because it’s there’s nothing wrong with it. But when you look at Cardi B, who has done so much and who I think is incredible. And I also stand her. She is always having to be reminded of the fact that she did sex work, like whenever she talks about politics, for example, and she’s actually very lucid on politics and has really interesting things to say about Bernie Sanders and class and the kinds of things that she would love to see happening in the political sphere. And people are real quick to criticize her and call her a stripper for daring to opine on the world that we live in. It’s really ridiculous. And so I wish that the conversation had opened up beyond sort of making sex work acceptable for white heterosexual men.

S2: Hmm. Okay. So sometimes Channing works for me. I mean, obviously, the pony scene and Magic Mike was unforgettable. And then sometimes he doesn’t. And I wonder if he is. I mean, do you think.

S9: I guess I shouldn’t ask you this. Kabaddi know your answer.

S2: Is he one of those people that, you know, you really need him to be in the right angle, in the right light? But I guess that’s all of us.

S36: I have never. There is no angle in which I would not find him to be an absolute delight. Wow. Yep. I will take all of those angles any day of the week. Absolutely. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

S30: You know, I’ve actually upclose it’s or exciting this in that like every so often in the earlier days when I would profess my attraction, people would be like, oh, he’s like a potato. And I’m like, well, I don’t know if you know this, but potatoes make chips.

S55: I also like potatoes are delicious, like. He’s baffled by it. I like sayto.

S17: This is what I’m saying. I’m like like you said, like that kind of cornfed potato. Even better. Like a big strapping lad, my friend Hannah Coles. She describes it as a. He’s a healthy boy. It feels to me like Channing is a healthy boy. And I am more often than not. I am available to kind of like examine him from any angle should he wish. And one of the things I really love about him, which. I think is.

S23: I don’t know how you feel about this as part of his Ilir, but like he seems to be someone who is in possession of a big and rich sense of humor. Yeah, he is so aware that, listen. It’s all ridiculous. Might as well have some fun. And I love seeing him.

S16: Like you said, that sly smile. I just love seeing him smiling.

S56: He’s so self-aware. And I find that really attractive. At one point during one of our conversations, he said something like, I know I’m not the greatest actor. And I was just like, oh, honey. And just like that. He doesn’t like, you know. Oh, there’s some people who are, you know, think that they might be Oscar worthy when they’re actors, when they’re really good at their job, but they’re never gonna be an Oscar winner.

S58: But they don’t know it. And I think he could win an Oscar. But, you know, he has this sort of self-deprecating self-awareness and he, I think, recognizes the fleeting nature of fame and doesn’t take it too seriously, which seems to be the healthiest way of surviving Hollywood. And so I really appreciate that. And also, he leans into his sexuality and his sexiness like he knows what he looks like and what reaction he gets. And instead of trying to play coy around it, which we see a lot of men do. He leans into it, which I think is incredibly healthy. And if Magic Mike didn’t necessarily, you know, make things more open for sex workers, it certainly did make things more open for women to express sexuality and lust and without shame. And I think that cannot be under appreciated. It’s so important. Mm mm mm mm mm.

S17: We did, we did a a movie screening, a thirsty movie screening of Magic Mike XXL. I think a couple of years ago I think it was I think it still remains our fastest selling. We sold out the venue. And I think that was the fastest any thing we’ve ever done has sold out. I think people were just really ready. And just again, like you said, like the celebration element to it. I’ve just kind of like, yes, I want to talk about how much I like watching men dance. And I want to kind of just like enjoy myself and people, gay people of all sorts of gender expressions and sexualities and the sound from that cinema. Oh, my gosh. Like it really was it was heartwarming. And I know that’s a really weird word to use for like we all went to see a sexy movie. But there is something so unabashed and joyful about the way people were weeping and throwing their fake money at the screen. And I just I left that cinema and I felt like I was floating. And I just thought, gosh, this is such a important power to have to have in the world. And yeah, it’s a very small thing in the grand scheme of our lives, but it’s such a vital small thing. And I I’m really glad and grateful that Magic Mike, especially Magic Mike XXL, which as we all acknowledged, the superior movie.

S58: Oh, yeah, the first one. It was good. I mean, it was good and cute and so on. But. The second one truly was just like, you know. Let’s abandon the pretense of trying to, you know, make this serious. I mean, it was serious, but in its own way. And it just leaned into sex and sexuality and it featured women of all shapes and sizes enjoying sexuality, which is another thing that I think was so groundbreaking. You know, when he went to Domino and they were, you know, that little field trip. What a delight. I need a spin on the scene on sexuality front and center without shame.

S17: Well, there wasn’t there was it wasn’t played for comedy. It wasn’t for like lulls. Like it’s just kind of like these women have money and they have brought themselves to a place where they want to feel good. And guess what? They’re going to leave here feeling good. And when you wrote about that scene in the in the article on the buzzer, it’s I love it because it’s full of parentheses that just contain the word. Yes. With multiple S’s, like it’s just kind of like this. Amazing. Just. I don’t know if there was something about that scene where everybody is kind of like, yeah, yeah, we know why we came here. This isn’t a no one sprung this on us. This wasn’t kind of like, oh, my God, what’s going on? It was like, no, these women put on their clothes, they put on the shoes, they packed their ones kind of, you know, in a bag and then came over to get what they wanted and shout out to Jada Pinkett Smith. This is a complete sidebar. But when I think about her as room in that movie, I just saw my whole chest gets warm. I’m just so happy that they cast her and she killed it. And her chemistry with Channing. Another point in his favor. Can I just say listen.

S2: Listen. OK. So that moment, the moment where he is dancing, when you finally get white chocolate or whatever when come out, right? Yeah. White chocolate. When he finally released him and then he has those two women bent over. And then like he tags one and then turns around and like tags the other. And he’s basically like, you know, pantomiming that he’s fucking them both. Like what? Listen, I feel like he has done that shit in real life and I feel like he was good at it. In real life. And I it gave me a whole new level of respect for him.

S3: I was still in that moment. I could tell Nicole your voice got real certain.

S61: I mean, she’s everywhere.

S2: That and one of those little lip sync battles where I think somebody did like a standing sixty-nine and they were like turned and had her crotch in his face while he was sitting down. And he was just like, yeah, this is natural. This this is what I do. This is how we do all the time. He just went with it and I was like, oh, do I need to do a somersault and put my shit on his face?

S19: Like, that’s what.

S2: Those are two very, very significant moments for me.

S3: I can see why. Nicole, I feel like this is the other thing that we don’t talk about enough anyway.

S17: I know some people talk about it. The thing about Channing, in addition to him being self-aware and funny and self-deprecating and all the other good stuff is he’s seems to be genuinely having a good time. Like my favorite one of my favorite lip sync battles is when he lip sings to be unsay and he’s doing around the world and he’s there wearing the bra and like the thing he has the wig on and then Beyonce that comes out. Now, listen, as we all know, Beyonce, that comes out like, what, twice a year on her non schedule, like things like she she was basically a pioneer of social distancing.

S23: Long before we all had to imagine the power of Beyonce. Like my mother. Much of the power of Channing that she’s like, you know what? I’m going to take one of my two scheduled like out of the house times. And I’m going to dedicate it to my good friend Channing Tatum. I’m going to come and dance alongside him to run the world. We’re gonna have a good time. And a part of me is kind of like Channing. What do you know how much power you have to like Darryl outs-, Queen Bee. Do you know the power you have? She doesn’t come out for just anyone. Exactly. And if that had a stamp of approval. I don’t know what is.

S2: Roxanne, can you tell us can you give us any hints about your project? Is it still on course to come out this year? More willing.

S63: And the creek don’t rise, but it’s not because of the pandemic. I just haven’t made enough time for it because I I overbook myself on. That’s just the truth. But I do think it will be out next year. Oh, okay.

S2: I see. Yes. Okay. Well, we will look forward to that.

S63: It’s pretty good. I have to admit, it’s people are going to be delighted by it.

S21: Oh, wow. I’m already all the way in. I don’t know about Unical.

S2: I’m there. And look, if he’s still. Single and looking. I am single and available and now, now we could just, you know, if you want to hook that up or any other kind of blind date for me, that would be awesome. Are you doing. Are you doing it? brigety it’s getting so real in this self isolation.

S3: You want to negotiate? Tabrizi Right. It’s like whenever I think about the fact that Megan’s friends look kind of like, Hey, we know someone for you, and it turned out to be Prince Harry. You were basically saying her exams would be like, Hey, I know you should go out with my friend chatting. I’m going to start adding dates of in your house. Why not? I mean, he could come to Flatbush kind of like a sliding block.

S36: He would handle flowers just fine. Let me tell you. Mm hmm.

S30: Oh, my gosh. That racially curious note.

S25: I feel like Roxann.

S21: Where can people find your work?

S63: I have written a few books, and so my most recent solo book was Hunger A Memoir of My Body.

S64: I recently ended a magazine called Gay Magazine at Gay, that medium dot com. And I’m here and they’re all over the Internet. So, you know, Google image and Google a bit.

S8: I know it’s like nothing matters much more and nothing matters. Google a bit.

S25: I know it’s going to be my Twitter. Yes, Google it.

S2: But if you’re on Twitter, you can find Roxann at are gay and you can go to her Web site, Roxane Gay, dot com. That’s Roxann with 1 in the people 1.

S17: Those of us from the Tumblr days we remember the north remembers. It’s one end. Guys, come on.

S2: And you can also listen to Roxane Gay and her co-hosts, Chessie McMillon Cottam at here to Slay where you can find it on Luminary podcast.

S7: Yes, we will. Yes. On Hensleigh, where we note. Yes, you were. Oh, yeah, we were time. It was so long ago. And it really was. Yeah. Then I used to ride with the bison condos.