That Sturdy Feeling With Driadonna Roland

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S1: Winston MY VOICE BREAKS ON HIS NAME. I got you. He assures me his voice confident as he. I can almost reach. A little more I say under my breath and then I. I smiled down at Winston. All over my face. You’re a mess.

S2: You’re an actual honest to god mess. I.

S3: Blame Winston. I’m not gonna do that. Like a good Christian man did nothing.

S4: Fine Nick.

S5: Hi Bill. How are you. I’m good. How are you. Well I’m feeling good feeling great.

S4: Oh yeah. Yeah. Okay. You had a little reason. Yeah I’ve had a lot of carbs today.

S5: So I’ve been like the happiest place like that should is being converted right now to energy in my body.

S3: Yeah. That’s a carbohydrate. Yes. So I had too many carbs. I would just come back.

S6: From vacation. I was in Rome which is beautiful. My first time and all I ate was passed on bread. And I need like two weeks of salads just salads and greens and all the roughage right now.

S3: Wow that’s incredible detail. Yeah. Hey listen we’re all adults. We understand you got to keep things moving. Listen. Congrats to fiber and raw food. That’s. That’s that’s what American wrote. That’s what America runs on. Listen I do not want to be miserable while I’m thirsty and I tell you that. That’s a horrible horrible image. Anyway. Anyway yes I used today. Yes. We have a special guest. Yes we do. One of our favorite people we say that about everybody but really she. This person is the cook. We only attract great people. I just I can’t it’s not my fault. All my friends are great. This is all the friends of the show agree. Yes we are ourselves great. Yes. Use us buckets. I guess you’re great too because here you are selecting this podcast. So shout out to everybody we’re all good. Today’s guests really truly is one of our favorites. We love her. Yes. Yea to. Nicole who’s our guest this week.

S1: We have a fantastic wonderful incredible Drea Donna Roland.

S4: Me. Let’s introduce you. Calm down.

S7: Drea. Roland is a writer and producer who covers sports and entertainment and you can find her work everywhere from complex to BuzzFeed via a TV Guide and essence among many other places. So you need to hire her to write host produce or edit everything she loves 90s R and B because I mean hello. She has incredible taste which is why we have her on the show.

S8: Exactly. That good taste is what we are going to explore this session. We have so many things to discuss with you because Drea you are in fact a very thirsty individual but people don’t know that and that’s why this moment is so huge.

S9: You understand like I’m about soldiers on my truth very thirsty person. Well we’re here to do. I’m so grateful I’ve had to carry this along for so long.

S3: Carry it no further. It facilitates your first exposure. Oh man yeah I’m really excited. I see. Your eyes all bright and shiny. Really. Guys thank you.

S4: So let’s get into it. Let’s do it.

S8: So we have a selection of people that you are feeling quite strongly towards and about let’s start with your very first choice.

S10: Who do you want to talk about first dream I think I want to start with Stefon James. Look at Yeah I got him stuff for. A young man. Well let’s start there.

S3: Why are you body rolling right now. It is over here.

S9: Just like I like someone is like a lost soul feel like oh my god a shimmy happening right now.

S4: Yeah. Explain.

S9: Explain yourself huh. Where do I start. Stefon James is when I say he’s a vibe right. Like he’s doing this thing where he’s very like protective of his image and his you know I think he’s trying to be respectable in that kind of thing. But I see enough in his eyes and his smiles and know that is some mischief up in the and I feel like. We both have a motherfucking bar. I just feel like if I could get him out of that sucks and we was in a house jelly like we would have fun.

S3: He has a fun vibe you’re saying. So let’s let’s let’s talk about the fun then.

S8: So he is like he’s a Canadian actor. Where might people have seen Stephane and his beautiful face.

S9: Well he’s been doing a wonderful job of crossing over its America lately so you might have seen him in Selma playing John Lewis. Yes you might have seen him opposite Julia Roberts in homecoming on Amazon. You also might have seen him. You should have seen him. And if Beale Street could talk yes okay. Yes yes.

S11: All right. Yeah. So yes you’re right. He started out his career in Canada where he’s from. He is. He’s a Toronto person. And I was on the correct pronunciation but I am British and we in fact pronounce all the T’s so it’s Toronto. He comes from an acting family. His brother is is an actor as well. He is Jamaican. Shout out to the Diaspora. Love it. Proud of it but then he moved to America. He’s kind of been slowly like you said making waves. He was a beautiful luminous fantastic John Lewis in overdue Venice film Selma. But yes for me I mean I thought he was very cute. I wanted to feed him some kind of green situation. When I saw him in Selma I was like Oh my God I hope he’s getting all the vitamins he needs. But then I watched him in Barry Jenkins film if Bill Street could talk which is the adaptation of The James Baldwin novel and my feelings were nothing to do with making sure he stayed regular.

S9: You know it was still it was still a slow burn for me like I saw him and I was captivated but I just it just made me want to study him. And so that’s what I began like following him on Instagram and reading all articles and. This is a descent into one woman’s this journey and that’s when I actually when I went to Instagram she said she’s a fucking detective. I had to research like I wanted to learn more about this person because it was just like first of all what an honor to be able to a Death Star in an adaptation of the first James Baldwin novel to me right. You know I mean tons of films. I’m like okay people obviously have a lot of faith in him right. Let me see what else is not on there when I watched homecoming and I saw how you I mean you would expect Julia Roberts to eat him up and that is not what happened. He helped us all he was I mean his performance was so strong and. I was like OK so you’re talented. And you’re fine. And for me it always starts with respect. So I just really I have respected the choices he’s made. I respected his performance and everything I’ve seen him in. And then the third fell upon me after there was a foundation of respect one more time.

S8: Say that again the first fell upon me the third spell upon me as I have what a testimony and you know what drew you can have a testimony without a test. And it seems that he’s tested. Like.

S3: Doing this. I’m proclaiming some truths. Okay Drew. You can agree or disagree but I. Your silence told me you do agree. Yeah.

S12: If Beale Street could talk was my first time seeing him I think our Canadian listeners out there will recognize him from Degrassi The Next Generation which right. You know it’s not anything that I paid attention to. I was a little too old for that. But he was so beautiful. I remember I tweeted that I’ve since deleted all my tweets but after seeing the movie and then I was listening to the soundtrack which is. Hold on let me. The soundtrack is gorgeous.

S9: That’s a Nicolas Patel that makes you want to fall in love. I was like Can somebody just look at me the way Stefon James is looking at Kiki and everything like that’s all I want.

S11: That’s the Barry Jenkins classic really incredible close up where you feel like you are in the character’s eye with Stefon. There is so much to look at. Yeah. So much to see.

S9: He really expresses something exactly his eyes are very expressive. That’s why I said I see everything I need to see. You know he does say it all sound. When I look at nose eyes. Honey they ask Daddy. They see through you that they got. Secrets like the father knows some stuff he as well as mine is beyond his years. I can tell just by looking. In his eyes and also those lips. Very I want to thank you for every close.

S13: Shout out to you Mr. Jenkins.

S14: Thank you. There is a very tender love making scene and this is something that I think Barry Jenkins does very well is showcasing black people in intimate moments and specifically dark skinned black people in these very soft tender sweet intimate moments that we don’t.

S15: Often see like obviously we see black people on screen you know being sexual with each other and things like that. But the care that funny shows Tish is just so sweet and remarkable and that also I mean obviously I mean so I’m looking at the sexy stuff. But that really I felt like that was also part of Stefan’s charm that quiet heat that he has. And you can see that it’s just a little wave of something coming off him. But again Barry Jenkins is just really good at that and I think it’s very important that we see these dark skinned people these dark skinned black people having tenderness together in show for show. I 100 percent agree.

S12: Yeah. So after the movie and I’m listening to the soundtrack. Which composer Nicolas Patel did. Just beautiful. And I’m not really a soundtrack listener. You know just for whatever because it makes me think of the movie which is distracting for me like when I’m writing.

S16: That’s okay. Yeah. So I’m listening to it and I tweeted that.

S17: Listening to the soundtrack makes me want to sit by the window and wait for a man with poet’s eyes. And what did I say. A man with poet’s eyes and a worker’s hands to come home because that’s how I saw asked to find James like he has these beautiful soulful eyes and by his hands you know in the movie he’s an artist and he’s Don’t you know he’s creating these sculptures and different things with his hands. And that really moves me because I like a man who works with his hands.

S4: But you know I just oh you know I was just like wow he is perfect for this role you know.

S17: And he has this something I think you’re kind of pointing out like this controlled passion. Yes there is just so remarkable even you can see it in his character. And then when he’s away from the screen and he’s doing interviews and things like that like he is you know he’s fairly young still and he is.

S3: He does have a little bit of that respectability they have. His interviews be dry. But. Tell us how you really feel that control.

S9: Because I know that he can turn it on and you might sometimes you see a glimpse of it like you might see him on a red carpet and he like he just had this mischievous smile and he’ll roll it back in. Yes I’m like he he knows you don’t.

S17: Yeah but you know he has to be careful when you’re still relatively new to this I mean you have to be careful and then there’s a burden of being a black man new to the scene and things that he takes it very seriously yeah.

S9: And I just want him to be fine and have fun like I think he’s in a place now where he can start to relax a little bit. And by that I mean like he every interview I’ve read he always talks about you know wanting to just the burden of representation and wanting to change the roles that black man can play again. He’s very excited for homecoming because it wasn’t written for a black actor but he obviously got the role. And I’m just like I hear you but like maybe be young and flexi like enjoying our moment like you don’t take it so seriously. I want him to but his legacy of course. Yeah.

S12: I wanted to talk about him I’m talking about legacy and things like that and I have a clip that I think perfectly illustrates that that I can play and this is from. He recently did a cover with Variety magazine and so they filmed you know some behind the scenes stuff and so I want to play that for you.

S18: I want to look around and see a thousand black leading young men you know guys like me who were who were doing it every day you know that doesn’t just have to be one of us of us. You know that can be a thousand words. I think with Duffy making strides with Duffy making strides. But honestly I can just say that I’m proud to be a part of this group that’s making the change and we can all share in each other’s work and celebrate each other’s work and uplift each other. And I think so. Diverse stories you know not just black stories but you know great stories that just happened to feature black artists which is which is even more important. So yeah.

S3: It’s not it’s not. The thing is he’ll figure it out. And I have no doubt of that.

S9: In the meantime it does put a slight dampener on my lady boner butts but also he’s 25 years old that boy is not 25 though boys could call me on the phone could read me books if you know.

S7: That’s what Michael B Jordan also said first was you know an adult and he you know he was away from the wire and he was trying to pick up these adult roles and things like that. So Michael B Jordan also said I want to get these roles that aren’t written for black people which you know it’s fine we understand there’s really not a good way to say that without seeming like you’re kind of pooh poohing arm the wide range of roles that black people can do as black people.

S11: Yeah I think it’s a problem with the expression of a very very real sentiment which is to say I don’t want to ever be limited by but it always comes across as just kind of like fuck these traditional ghetto holes.

S4: I don’t want it.

S9: I like buddy but I do think he has the range for it like he could be Batman. I think that his potential is limitless and I think even in the few roles we’ve seen like you can see that he is I mean he’s just so competent even that one scene and Beale Street I loved where he was pretending to to decorate this barren face and I just was like that’s how you have to have I will feel so silly doing that. But he just he likes it.

S11: There’s something about the way he does the when he’s kind of like essentially showcasing a future that your heart is breaking because you know they don’t have it you know they’re never going to get this future. So he’s doing this wonderful thing of telegraphing to you the genuine excitement of building a life with the woman he loves who’s gonna be the mother of his child there’s all this stuff and at the back of that he somehow also transmits to you the absolute futility of this exercise which is to say this is never going to happen but I love that scene so when I watch that scene in the cinema I without meaning to my eyes welled up because I just thought I want someone to imagine this for me and my right. Okay let’s let’s let’s all watch the clip and swoon. Would you think.

S19: Oh no funny.

S20: So the only thing we missing is a bridge. But I don’t want to throw my back out before we even have a chance to make. A LIVING. COME ON GIVE ME A HAND WITH THIS BRIDGE. YOU WANT ME TO MY. I means you get to do it. Get the door. Come.

S21: On. All right. All right. Ready. Yeah I’m ready. You ready. I’m ready. Three two one. All right you good. Yeah I’m good. All right.

S22: OK. Careful. All right. Why am I straining more than you. I got you guys right on back here. Yeah right here.

S23: Yes the audio is making us all male. Yes.

S7: He’s so good that he breathes De Franco and brings him into the fantasy and in the film you can see that the character is like Oh wow I’m really I’m really intrigued by this too I’m all into. He’s able to like cast this web of I don’t know enchantment around everybody.

S8: It’s the enchantment is exactly correct because if you look at you know Kiki Lane’s face. Yeah I know she’s acting silly but I’m like now. She’s also our audience standard.

S2: She’s looking at this guy like Oh my God he’s so amazing.

S8: Like I hated I hated how emotion like I felt myself swooning despite myself because I was just kind of like there’s two bits in there there’s of course the fridge which is just oh my God yeah. It turns out all I wanted was a guy to carry an imaginary fruit. That’s the only thing I’m putting in rights into buying now. Are you carrying an imaginary fridge. No. Get the fuck out. But then the. Also the bit where he talks about the sun on her pretty face. And I was like Oh my God she’s going to tell me about my pretty face.

S3: Tell me about my face. It’s so good. It’s so good. He’s great. Yeah. And he has a rich interior life. And I just wow that layer. All right Ed Drew. Oh.

S9: Yeah. Because he’s so careful of his image he keeps a lot inside. And I just feel like I’m here for that too.

S24: Yes. Yes. Yeah. We’ve got eat. No.

S4: No. Everyone here is too old. Everyone here is is way too too advanced in years.

S8: But let’s let’s go back. What you pointed out about where he lets loose. Oh yes. And that’s the fashion right. Sartorial choices impeccable topped up tell us tell us more about the sartorial choices that have piqued your interest so.

S9: Well I mean just for instance I love that his hair is nappy. Some would say natural but I just think that is a deliberate decision to be like I am a list I am playing with ever. Rene and Julia Roberts these are my colleagues and you want to get these kinks in his coils and he will be on the cover of Elle magazine with twist in his hair like that is an act of defiance as a black man as somebody in a position like you will never see Denzel wasn’t relaxed plan if it’s true or even has the Met Gala. Mm hmm. Honey let’s talk about John J. Went to the Met Gala and a deep green velvet Burberry suit. There was a brooch on his tie he had on a heeled boots and had the nerve to have us here. Kwame rode up until a man by at fashion’s biggest most elegant night. He had french braids on the red carpet. You want to stay like that is that is somebody who is comfortable in his masculinity he’s comfortable in his moments. He is you know he’s owning it. And I really love it. And even when he’s not like suited and bought it just as choices like on his off days like he’ll wear soft blush or hot pink he’ll put on all kind of funky jewelry like he’s just not afraid to just you know express himself in a way.

S11: And it just suggests a confidence to me that if I’m holding a track that the line of confidence I think is is very good because I did have some issues with his Met Gala look because so many people failed the fucking assignment to be camp so. So I was kind of like Stefon that could be camera you could be perfect yeah.

S3: You can be but I’m gonna I’m gonna go ahead and say he failed that he failed the general brief but did he look amazing. Yes he did.

S8: I feel like for me it was a case of just kind of like you can make all these choices within the auspices of fashion right.

S11: You can you can do menswear but you can do it in a way that really sets you apart where the clothes are not wearing you. Yes. And he does this thing every red carpet. I’m excited because I know he’s going to pass. He’s going to have some accessories he’s going gonna have a fantastic head of hair. Yes. There’s so much that he does and he. Like you said he comes in. It helps that he has the shoulders and he has the waist and he has you know I mean the stuff is just tailor.

S3: So when you see everything he has to offer you just like I’m winning is a prize for his right. Yeah. And then he just steps out all 3D and every time my heart is glad I just had to say that yes he just add some flavor to the red carpet that has been sorely missing.

S9: But he wears his hair and I think it’s just a very deliberate choice to have natural hair kinky coyly hair interjects a position of it with his stature in Hollywood and maybe with you know a fine high could soar. So you know I mean just to have your hair natural light that like it sends a message. And so like when I think about him and his hair that’s a song if you guys heard this song by a lucky day. His car rose the mole and it’s literally about just smoking we watch a baby and like when I hear it I just visualize like Stefon is like OK he’s in my room right. And.

S25: This is not I don’t have curtains but if I did this the wind will be blowing the curtains right white golf course Curtains of course the sun is shining.

S26: And the song is playing and I am just I’m rubbing coconut oil in his hair I’m moisturizer his scalp. You feel me. Yes. You know he said he’s a painter. I’m clean his paint brushes like whatever you need. Well what his song plays like. This. This is what’s going to happen. This. Manifests this long if it doesn’t just transporting.

S3: PHONE DOWN ONCE FOR YOU. That’s our song. You don’t know it yet but that’s our song. How. That doesn’t sound creepy at all.

S24: All right. We’ve talked about stuff on James. Let’s move on to your next stop J. Bobby kind of darling. Bobby you say that like he was like an old love.

S3: Right. Well the year was nineteen ninety. Two. Below me with a little crab smoking a cigarette. I haven’t heard that name yet.

S27: Are you lady something. OK.

S9: Bobby is like the splash of hot salty butter. Oh cool.

S28: Oh I didn’t know why I did that. All right let’s get it set. I’d. Like to follow the trajectory of that sense as I leaned all the way in.

S29: You’re watching something and you already like it. And then Bobby. Kind of Ali pops up and you’re like Oh Bobby I missed you.

S8: Yeah. He does add a little extra. Always a garnish. Exactly. So that’s exactly the best way to encapsulate his earlier to me. He’s someone who I enjoy him if I know he’s going to be there. But if I didn’t know and he turns up I get so happy.

S9: I pay more attention more attention. Yeah. Yeah. And usually his presence is like oh shit it’s going to go down like this. Think about homecoming master of none. Like usually when he comes. Like well lot of mean nothing good fun a come method. Like you just got to keep your eyes on one of the bands. And I like that about.

S1: Yeah he has he’s always had like this grown man chaotic energy about him and that it’s also not just I don’t know Stephane we talked about he has this quiet he but Bobby is a little more staticky and like you constant you know the kind of person who when he enters the room your skin suddenly has goose bumps in your life.

S3: I mean you look at this bobbing you’re like Oh that’s right yeah yeah yeah. There’s something about him say listen so Bobby Bobby’s 49 years old and he is exact.

S4: Exactly. That was the correct of interests like fuckin Michael Barbaro was in there. But like here’s the thing. So he’s he’s from.

S8: He was born in 1970. So when we talk about grown men you talk about you know a direct contrast for Stephane who’s 25 years old. There is a man who is almost yeah. No I promise he does. That wasn’t a diss. I’m saying that here is a man who is double his age. Oh yeah right. Literally literally. And I think there’s something about him that I have always found very assured because even before he got to this age he had that grown man energy in a very big almost tangible way where you see him and I think Oh my God he’s gonna sort some stuff out. I trust him.

S3: Bright’s even what he’s come in play in a chaotic chaotic role or an asshole and I still just trust him likely he’s gonna figure it out. Yeah he’s being true to himself. He’s going to figure it out. He’s gonna be all right. Exactly.

S30: So that sounds like a sitcom but the way I came into him is like now I’ve known him for a lot of like kind of being a villain or a butthole. But when I first was introduced to him he was playing a character named Bobby on a show called Third Watch. All

S3: right. So two people watched listen you and me are the two people who are just said it. Was so sweet.

S9: He was just like this lovelorn paramedic paramedic who was obsessed with his partner and she just didn’t see it until he got shot. And then she was like I could’ve had a real one.

S3: Yes you could have killed Bobby wanted to hold you down as all he wanted to do was say them lies and hold you down there. You sound like you are Bobby’s girlfriend slash Mom. You are here to avenge your baby. I want him to be appreciated. Oh Bobby wanted was to just love his partner and she just she didn’t recognize and appreciate. You know what I really love about Bobby and third watch is that he asked to be written out because he was like Yeah. He said you’re not using me enough exact Bobby. Bet on yourself. That to me is maybe the hottest thing Bobby ever did. Dad watch has to be very honest.

S8: He said listen you know what. You’re not doing all that you could do with me in the room. So

S3: why don’t you just open the door and let me moonwalk out and then and then the biggest flexible. He then went on to have a proper career thereafter because I wasn’t going to be like you know what write me out and then you sit in there with no one picking up the phone. But I did. That was why he knew his wife and he acted upon that. So again welcome to Business with first aid kit. Handle your business and get out while you still can. But speaking of his career I compare him to like a Giancarlo Esposito. Right. Like they say they want a job.

S9: And he’s so versatile like his dad is Italian his mom is Cuban. And I feel like that diversity is reflected in the range of characters he plays. Like sometimes he is Spanish sometimes he’s Italian sometimes he’s a psycho sometimes he’s a sweetheart. Like he can give you anything. Like he has the range or whatever he is in a project. I know that he’s gonna give like a consistent solid performance. Right. Right. And again it goes back to the respect. Like I think he’s so talented. And then I’m able to appreciate that voice. Okay listen they call it I just made intense eye contact.

S8: Because there is something we’ve done an episode of Moises before on this day. Because we do think of them as very much instruments of firsts as well as communication low. But like ultimately what it comes down to the power of a voice the power that a voice can have over the state of desire is very very real. And Bobby’s voice is incredibly rich. It’s so deep.

S7: Yeah he knows when to make it smoky and low. He knows when to pitch it a little higher so that you know you’re like What the hell is this man about to do. What the hell Nicole. You never know. Right. Every now and I think the best example of that for me is his role as Gyp Rosetti on Boardwalk Empire.

S1: OK yeah.

S3: He was certifiable in that show and he was only there for a season. He was in the third season. You would think it was his show. Yes but he really took over the show that season that he was on and it’s also the season that we have Charlie listen a season of blessing. Yes. Every which way you look for a snack everywhere you look.

S6: So Bobby as GIP was this man who at home with his family. He was I guess you could say he was emasculated. You know he was in this traditional Italian family and so the women kind of ran everything there. And so he would try to overcompensate. Yes with all of his mafia bad guy dealings you know.

S16: And he. If someone said the wrong thing to him and they would know it was the wrong thing.

S1: Like Nucky. The main character of the show told him good luck Gyp. It’s like you could see a switch click in his head.

S23: And he was saying how dare you. You know. And he went on a rampage killing people just because I told him good luck. So that’s the range that we have here. Also his character like to be choked during sex. There is this one thing we’re not going to play any clip from it because it’s so difficult to listen to. You have to just watch it wildly offensive. And without the context it just seems.

S8: Unnecessary. Yeah. Well you should watch it. It’s like oh it’s a fascinating bit of television.

S16: Yeah.

S23: So there’s a scene where he’s in bed with a woman and he has asked her to tie his belt around his neck and then tie the belt to the bed. Oh he won’t be choked choked. Yes. Yes. And so they are doing what you do when you ask somebody to choke you like that. And this other guy comes in and starts shooting up the place. So rosette is like I gotta get you know get me out of this blah blah blah.

S16: And then he gets free and then he’s you know leaves the bedroom and starts shooting at everybody and he is fully naked and bloody because the woman has been a victim of the shooting. He is bloody naked still. I believe he still has the belt around his neck and you see full frontal. Oh yeah. Yes. Bobby bless you. Because even though this scene is terribly violent and you are covered in blood. You are an impressive impressive person.

S4: While I want I want I want everyone to know that I did not take part in any of that but shout out to Bob. Listen. Suddenly suddenly I will say this.

S8: We’re all God’s creatures everything is beautiful. But sometimes you have a look at someone and go aha I know the secret to your confidence I just shout out to you Bobby. The thing about Bobby for me really is like you said Drea he is the person who adds extra. And I think about this in terms of like a high dollar sign feature.

S3: Oh my God. That’s horribly accurate. Have I ever missed. No Bobby don’t miss.

S8: He has this deep commanding voice. He’s dark. He’s kind of swarthy. You know he’s on like I’m. So dark and handsome you know. I can’t help it. He plays absolute psychopaths. People who are you wouldn’t want to be in a dark corner with. And then he also plays people who are incredibly sweet. For me one of the best examples of that for me is when he plays Vince in Will and Grace which is the lonely.

S9: Yeah he it’s a really wonderful performance. It was so warm. He was so funny his comedic timing was just. And his chemistry will will actually. Yeah. Officer. Arrest me. For being an Eddie. I feel. Awful. I made a horrible mistake that I thought it was for.

S31: This for. I was just. Playing Game.

S8: Become a romantic. Call me old fashioned. But I believe when a guy picks another guy out. Treat him like a lady. Sometimes when I think about Bobby it’s obviously in the more like Nichols of the stereotypical roles that they kind of shoehorn him into and he’s very good in them right. But I always love to be surprised by Bobby kind of barley performance because I know he can do it. And so when he delivers on that it’s always just gonna be Oh thank God. Like it’s something different.

S3: And I know he can do it. So yeah give him give him a full blown comedy I’m really ready for that. I would love to see it right. All right honey we’ve talked a little bit about his range and I think we should also mention that he is Tony nominated.

S7: He is on stage as well. He was nominated for the play more precious and for the motherfucker with the hat. Listen. What a sign of.

S3: That’s how I want to sign up for everything now a welcome the best they get. Yeah. Nicole and also the motherfucker with the hat you imagine who the fuck she thinks she is and I think it’s significant because not everybody can translate their talent from film to TV to the stage.

S6: We saw some. Well I saw a play earlier this year with that featured a television actor and they were not good on stage and you. It’s a special skill to be on stage and the fact that Bobby has that jazz again is that garnish on top of everything else that he brings to the table. He is such he’s so good and I you know obviously he has he gets the respect that he deserves. But I think he just needs a more more recognition. I think people need to give him more recognition and he’s got a lot louder. Yes he’s talked about how he likes playing the side characters because he thinks they’re richer. All right. I would agree. Yeah they’re richer.

S29: But also he makes them richer like everybody doesn’t. Lee doesn’t execute the way he does. You know you can watch a program and not care about the side characters. When Bobby is a side character or a supporting character like you lean in you know it’s not a real you in the real you and you’re speaking like a real first bucket. I’m grateful Drew.

S24: All right. So we’ve had stuff on James Bobby kind of Darling and now and now who made the character except not really because you feel you feel strongly about all these three men but this guy is pretty special to you.

S9: My goodness. And Winston Duke Winston Duke. OK.

S4: We all needed a moment of silence. So let’s listen.

S8: Let’s Buck regular class buggers who have been with us a while. Know how Nicole and I feel about Winston Duke. We ended up doing a video many many moons ago about his character in Black Panther because he played in Baku the leader of the Jabari. And I think in that video where we pretended or did we pretend to make a meal for our vegetarian King I believe Nicole called it a hot rice dish for a hot king. Yeah. And I think at the time I kind of just groaned gently but she wasn’t wrong. She wasn’t wrong. We’ll put the link up to this video that we made and you can see us preparer lovingly prepare a meal for our B but Winston is an old favorite here. Thursday Ken and Daria we are looking to you now to color in some of the excitement around Winston. Okay well.

S4: I love scholarly approach. You took a sip of water knocking on her pipe. I’m glad you asked.

S30: One day somebody said to me you have a type. And I said No I don’t. And I said your type is men who look like they like the dark meat or chicken. Wow. Wow man who look like they like black eyed peas and cornbread. Know when she said it I understood it. I think you just me. I like a sturdy cane. I like somebody I can build with somebody who look like they got good sense but also like they can handle you. And I just think Winston Duke know what to do with it and every. Possible you understand like.

S29: I’m going to marry rich first of all rich and maybe famous but I need him to be rich. But like his heart in the right place. And Winston just seems like all of this. These men seem like they fit that bill. You know like I can trust them. They got they go to work. They work hard they might need business they make their money they come on home like they can be there when I when I get out for you know I can be what is supposed to be what I say they are. You understand. Yes. Yes. I feel you. I just trust these and Winston in particular like physically he’s my type.

S3: Like I like. Explain. Explain the physical part. Did you see the picture of him on the horse Instagram. Yeah yeah. Yes we did. Yes yes yes yes yes yes. Yes I was starting to think that was I.

S4: Thinking about those bozos like Wait hold on hold on a fucking minute. Hold on.

S9: Guys. They just offer me security in this cold hard world. Like his eyes. Yes yes yes yes yes. He’s tall broad shouldered. He takes his mother to all of his functions. Yeah. You know I’m just a cover up. Michael B Jordan needs to do that and it just because you’ve got so many holes you can’t pick one. Oh my God. I really believe he just wants his mother to share in the moment. Yeah well I think the.

S4: Join us next week on Detective dream she said that should definitively like I’ve got the evidence I have the receipt.

S8: This motherfucker is out there running games. This one loves his mother. That’s what I believe. No it’s true.

S7: Lean into that drama.

S4: You know you mentioned the sturdy feeling in my heart from this dirty feeling it such time for a novel from the 40s. Maybe not that’s 30 feeling. Maybe that’s the title of this episode. The sturdy feeling. But ok.

S16: Stefan James has families to make in right.

S7: Then Bobby Carnevale is half Cuban and Winston Duke is from Trinidad and Tobago. So we’ve got a little Caribbean little thread a little Caribbean thread through all of this with the sturdy yet sturdy and so then still is like the image they craft in public. I know it has to be different from who they are when I get them alone because they’ve got that Caribbean inside like they crazy. Ones.

S3: Think I am crazy. Deep down inside and I’m gonna bring it up. You gonna bring it out. You think you can handle the crazy honey the same way that he can handle you handle me who can handle me. Oh wait.

S10: Get out. Megan making get. Up here. Hey do you think. Okay. Winston let me tell you something.

S9: Because I remember the black panther. He said how black women made him feel sexy for the first time. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe that’s just the beginning of it. It gets better like. The best thing you can do for yourself is let a black woman love you. Oh I don’t want to disrespect his partner or whatever he has going on right now but I’m just saying it get greater. BABY LIKE COME TO THIS SIDE. WE GOT YOU ON A DIFFERENT THING.

S10: GO BACK TO AFRICA. I guess ancestral. Ancestors. GO HELP ME LOVE YOU LIKE I GOT IT.

S4: I can’t believe you want to ancestral things. Give us a first aid kit. And I’m so grateful that it was you drilled on a Roland that brought that to me. Only you were first largely introduced to Winston through Black Panther.

S6: As in Baku. And for me I remember the first time that I went to see the film and he is who I came away thinking about right. With all the shock. Yes. Was surprised me because you know as everybody knows that’s not typically my type I don’t typically like a big strong looking man like that you know. Right now you love a French driver. Yes I like a little slim you know little tall drink of water.

S3: But I came out at the end. I was like oh well I’ll bet he was on the throne. He was man spreading on the throne. The only acceptable man spreading the only the only everybody else. You’re not on the throne you’re on the fucking for train. Close your legs. Yes.

S17: And there was this scene is after a kill monger has come to the condo and done what he needed to do there. And so Marco is on the throne and we’ve got Angela Bassett we’ve got Leticia right there. We’ve got Martin Freeman. He’s only way my white men in this room. Everybody’s talking you know about what kind of business Martin’s character Ross tries to insert himself and embark who was like No I want to play that clip. I make different announcements that go.

S32: Well. Your Highness. The new king is this the new.

S33: You cannot talk one more word and I will feed you to my children.

S32: I’m kidding.

S3: We are vegetarians.

S17: I love that I was just so funny and to see this little bit of humor from him and that humor. We ended up seeing more of us.

S9: Yeah yeah. Daria we had the pleasure of seeing us together. He and I. And you know they said it was a scary movie but when I saw those pies I said everything is gonna be all right here.

S4: Everything is under control. I feel like wrap it up guys love it.

S9: I said we know that Winston went to Yale. He is classically trained and I think he is definitely choosing roles now that he has the privilege to do so that show his humanity and don’t show him as you know this physically intimidating person whenever he has the opportunity and he really showcased that in us. He was corny he was silly he was sexy he was you know all at once.

S7: He was a corny dad. He had all these dad jokes. You know a lot of people have problems with the fact that he was so corny once the once the tethered came in. You know he got beat up and he was crying out he was you know EXCLAIMING IN PAIN. He was hurt and all this kind of stuff. You know a lot of people like he should just man up. Why was he blah blah blah. And I think it’s important like you just said to see this big man express pain to see a black man be able to express pain because we black people are often not allowed to express pain.

S6: We are supposed to be stoic and to suffer and yes but to see this man who yes he I guess you know head of the family or at least is the husband is the father in this family.

S34: He is hurt tethered fuck them up.

S7: You should be able to express that fact that people were upset with him you know giving voice to being fucked up.

S9: Just also the same size as a tether for obvious reasons. Cause it’s not going to be like oh just man up and knock them out like no. That was a fair fight. Honestly unfair because the tether had been plotting for a long time. Right.

S8: I didn’t watch us but I remember watching the trailer and you know he’s wearing the Howard sweatshirts shadow to see as he is you know. Yeah. The cornea is I have to say that would have been a reason for me to watch. I still didn’t but I I just loved seeing this guy kind of tell these jokes and be a little bit of a cornball. I do think that when we are thinking about the ways in which people are represented because let’s be real representation as a as a thing is kind of played out everyone’s you know that’s not what we’re looking for what we do want to see some kind of accuracy. Yeah I think so often. Yeah. Like you said big black man and not so put they’re supposed to be impervious. Nothing ever fills them.

S29: They’re supposed to do sort of well. Yeah I know. And I like that he’s not cool. I know some uncool black people in real life.

S4: I mean I’ve heard about them. So yeah.

S35: I thought I already done told George to get off my property. Okay. So if you don’t want to get crazy we can get crazy.

S8: So I do think you know like I think about also the fact that yeah his career at this point is still his his list his filmography is still so short. But in that time can I just say he has done some excellent work with some really excellent people. Yeah. And I’m grateful to Jordan Peele much like we were happy about how Barry Jenkins framed Stephan James. I’m super super delighted that we got that Jordan Peele also did such a wonderful job of just again showcasing this and Ryan Coogler did that with Black Panther and making in Baku. This you know incredible. I mean that’s his big screen debut. Let’s not forget Marco is the first time he was on in a film on a feature length film.

S3: Right. And he knocked it out of the pocket and logic coming into a Marvel Universe movie and stealing the show so comprehensively right. Your first go around. Yes. Shout out to you. You know who did that last time. Oprah Winfrey with her debut in the color purple.

S8: What I tell you legacy in terms of like people who come out on their first go is like this thing is a scene stealing just like bigger than life performance and Baku you’re looking at him and like Nicole said you leaving you like who the hell is that.

S7: Exactly. Exactly. It’s power. Absolutely. So in us we’ve got him as a corny dad who expresses pain but Jordan Peele also has this moment where he gives us what we have been looking for various talked about those thighs. And there’s a scene where he goes into the bedroom and he’s trying to like you know have some quality time with Lupita Nyong’o her character and he gets on the bed. He takes up the whole space of the bed and he’s in like a T and some boxers.

S16: So you know he’s not even naked or anything like that. He gives in a bit ahead. Again that man spreading thing yes see I not know that he is framed as his partner.

S23: Yes. I was like Thank you Jordan. Thank you. And that bit I know that it was at least a queen size I’d like and the fact that he just sat in the middle and just took up the whole thing like a tree.

S4: For me. Oh my God his PSA.

S10: That’s what I do I climb it like a tree. How do you do it. I would rock him to sleep like a baby. Okay. I promise you. I’m like a linebacker. I like a nice solid flip me upside down like. I was bullied him on purpose. Did I did what I could get away with just making the makeup sex would be crazy. So I got.

S7: Oh all right we.

S4: We have done a lot today perhaps too much. We have done too much the most the actual most. But it’s all come to the good dream.

S8: Thank you so much for coming in. And you by expounding on your many many thoughts on what induces this in you and by turns us I hope other people really see my heart.

S3: What is it your heart. Why wasn’t your heart. All right.

S7: Thank you love. This has been a ball. I’m so glad that we were grateful.

S29: We’re grateful to have you. Well. I’m trying to get you off for a minute and then the stars align. Yes they did. Where can people find you and your way. Oh please find me at Jerry TV. That’s D R E TV on Instagram and Twitter. My portfolio is at Jerry Donna. Dot com. I spelled it out for you guys. Please do D R I A deal and a drill down on dot com.

S9: Yeah I write I produce. I’m out here in these streets like hell at me.

S8: That goes not just for us to fun and Winston but generally speaking editors.

S3: Yeah. You want to get some of that good. Excellent work. Talk to Jerry Lee Connolly. She said You’ve got to sell yourself. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you so far.

S7: All right. Bam this have. This was such a good episode. I love you so much.

S3: She is be I don’t know. She’s like an honorary first Auntie. Yes. She hasn’t quite the turn of phrase as you and I know from our own personal life. Yes. Drink and coin a phrase like that but no that was a fun discussion.

S24: Yeah yeah. It took us on a journey first. It really did. And you know even though we have you know kind of diverse range here we have some relatively new people to the scene and there’s someone who is an O.G. a veteran. That was nice. So we talked about Stefon James Bobby kind of Varla. Yes we did. And Winston do glisten. So I mean I’m I’m ready to hear who you are your Drabble about.

S8: Listen. OK. So in the spirit of allowing new blood into the world OK I decided to take my first pocket literally at the door of Stefon James. Oh.

S2: Your eyes are a light. Yes yes. I just. I figure there’s something about him.

S8: He is the guy that I would have hoped I would have fallen in love with at the age of 14. Oh you know what I mean. Yeah yeah.

S36: He’s got like a very sweet boy next door energy to him with a bit of heat like mostly I feel I look at him and I feel like he’s someone I would have fancied. Yeah. At 14 and would have carried on funding would have been surprised and delighted to find that I still fancied him. 25 years later. You know what I mean. Yeah. That kind of. Yeah. That’s specific. That’s specific kind of first. So yes Stefon. Yeah. Yeah. Okay ready. All right.

S37: The fourth time I saw him I had to ask him for his name four times in as many weeks of bumping into one another in the communal stairwell meant I had to shed shyness. So far we’ve shuffled past one another with smiles that had bloomed wider than strictly necessary eyes suddenly wide faces suddenly prickly each encounter had shaded in previous broad strokes the smell of his cooking wafting through the nooks and crannies of our very old building the lingering scent of a woodsy cologne in the hallway late on a Saturday night the muffled sound of old or surprising music bubbling upwards into my apartment from his I noticed his sleepy brown eyes the first time the second time I noticed a tiny scar high on his neck at the highest point of where his collar pressed into his skin the third time the shape and size of his hands arrested me last time I spoke even before I had fully descended the stairs from my floor you again I said voice slightly too high to fake casual he half turned still in the middle of turning his key me again he returned I added great speaking voice to my ever growing internal catalog of His blessings. I’m Bem 70 I blurted before I could talk myself out of it jerking my head back to indicate my apartment upstairs. His recovery was quick but noticeable. It’s fine he said extending his hand our palms touched and we both let our involuntary breaths. It’s nice to meet you them he said. I felt the warmth curl all the way up in me Oh.

S38: Steph I got you all shook. All right Elvis. I love it.

S3: Single girl I love it also as well in addition so I’m glad you like that. Yeah. Little bit of little bit of Stefon. Yeah. You know thirst makes you very observant. Here’s the thing.

S36: I could be walking around as though I cannot see. And then when I see that’s all I see so that’s a yes.

S3: I feel you. You get it. Okay. So I’ve kind of a shed my own skin. I did too much. But I want to know who your thumbs up because you have a smorgasbord. Yes. Who did you go for. I also went with to find. Blood. I love I love the moment when we both discover a new yes. Yeah kind of like a we’re all in. Yeah. Okay. I am very excited to hear what you have cooked up.

S1: You fine Stefan gathers me close from behind and kisses me on the back of my sweaty neck. He places a hand over my rapidly beating heart. I can feel him smile in the place he just kissed me he wants some water he asks his voice touching all the spots still tingling from his hands I lick my lips are try to my mouth having gone cool and dry from his expertise with my body shut up. Yes please I croak out this earns a full chuckle from him and he moves from the bed he remains naked as he walks to the kitchen his wiry build Deb and shining and all the good places he brings me back a quart sized mason jar of ice water looks like you really need this he smirks at me I have hardly take a swipe at him I let him be a little smug he’s earned it that’s. What. I’m so sorry that reveal. Of where the location of this once.

S34: You know. OK.

S23: I do a lot of the like the leading up to the fade to black. And now I’m just you know I went to see what it looks like on the other side. Is that what you want. Yeah. I feel like they’re fine with that little sizzle. You know that we were talking about the little bit of heat that he has coming off of him.

S3: I think he’s got a little bit of air against the law but he’s still tender to go get you some water because you clearly like dehydrated.

S2: Yes fine. I did not ask for any of that but I was freaking out. The fact that you revealed the shit so casually. Thank you for that thesis on your travel. Anybody asking about that. But I’m glad that you had the presence of mind to present it. Yes. Listen Nicole yes. What you don’t need to do was that.

S34: But I’m glad you did. I feel like stuff. Come on. Hey check this out. I mean a little bit I feel I do.

S3: I feel both lovingly held but I also like short of breath. So Chad use used often. I will say this.

S8: He only gets more attractive. Absolutely. Imagine if you will 15 to 20 years from now.

S1: Oh my God of salt and pepper beard. Listen. And the confidence.

S3: Listen in like a plum colored suit. Yes. Are you kidding me. Wow. Fucking hell Stefon. I mean here you are. Listen. Okay. I don’t know who listens to the show. We know a lot of people do. And no boasting just back to toot.

S8: Stuff on your people. I. I want you to consider coming to talk to us. We see you. Okay. And we want you to see us back. Yes. All right. Well there you have it first buckets. Two very different dribbles. I’ve lost my was two very different dribbles today. One of them exploring a before and one very much after. And it’s up to you whichever one speaks to you the best. But let’s. Let’s go to Twitter. Go to our first aid kits. Twitter accounts and we’ll we’ll post up a link and in a day or so and you can. Yeah. Responders as you responded to the stories on this show got sick.

S4: My eyes are closed. I’m looking at them. I’m looking. I’m looking to the Lord.

S8: Shout Outs. Shout out to Nicole and her pen hoof. Yeah we love a Drabble so yes. Also feel free to send us yours if you also are having thoughts about Stephane or Bobby or even Winston. By all means please send us a Drabble.

S37: Nothing too long because we’re not going to read that but if you give us something concise and affecting every chance that we will read it on and also applaud your own thirst. So send us your name and your pronouns and a Drabble under Mike could hear it on Thursday kids and the email address to send that to would be first aid kits at Slate dot com. We look forward to hearing all about your first.

S39: First aid kit is a Slate production produced by Cher Vincent and s Nicole Perkins and bam out on me. The senior managing producer of Slate podcast is Joan Thomas and the editorial director is Gabriel Roth. Our music is by Tanya Morgan.

S13: You can follow the show on Twitter. At first aid kits and we’re at Bemidji U. That’s B I am a GW and Tennessee Whiskey woman. That’s tea and whiskey with an E woman. Plus we are on tumblr. Shout out to our Oh Jesus folks who hold us down every single week and we are at first aid kit podcast dot Tumblr dot com. Please feel free to send us questions because we might answer them.

S39: Our guest Drea Donna Roland is on Twitter at Dream TV. That’s D R E TV and her Web site is Katrina Donna. Dot com D are I a d o and a dot com. If you live tweet your Listen we’d love to see it and see what you what stood out to you this week. Please use the hashtag tack pot t AKP O.D. and also feel free to send us an email with your thoughts. At first aid kit at Slate dot com.

S13: We are delighted to let you know that yes we are in fact still making use of first Somali service. So please send us a short and we do mean short voice notes via email and we can see if we can find you new and similar crushes if you would like to make use of the first Somalia service please send us that voice note. Again we have to say a short voice note telling us who you fancy and who you want help with the address to send it to is first aid kit at Slate dot com. Also a quick public service announcement. Now the war on the Slate podcast network. We want to let you know about Slate Plus Slate Plus Slate’s membership program and members not only help support our show and other podcasts but they also get great benefits and return the biggest for you. First book is out there is listening to Slate podcast with no ads. But you also get bonus segments and episodes of shows like Dear Prudence and slow burn. So sign up for Slate Plus now it’s only thirty five dollars for the first year. Head over to Slate dot com slash first aid plus that Slate dot com slash first aid plus if you have the time please head over to Apple podcasts and leave us a review on the star rating. We think that 5 stars is appropriate. So please and thank you and we’ll be back next week. Remember hot beverages still count towards your water input but stay thirsty. Singing about my pay.

S10: Talking about my birthday my three ball Daddy.