Mom and Dad Are Fighting: Breast Milk Taste Test Edition

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S1: This ad free podcast is part of your Slate Plus membership. The following podcast contains explicit language.

S2: Welcome to Mom and Dad are fighting Slate’s parenting podcast for Thursday October 10th. The breast milk taste test edition. I’m Rebecca Lavoy a journalist and host of the podcast crime writers on I live in New Hampshire and my kids are Henry who’s 18. Teddy who is 16 and a half and my stepdaughter Lily who is 19.

S3: And I’m Dan Simon editor at Slate and the author of How To Be A Family in stores now. I’m the dad of Lyra who’s 14 and Harper was twelve today on the show.

S2: We’ve got a question from a parent wondering whether it’s cool or weird to let her six year old sampled her breast milk. Plus a question about whether it’s OK or not OK to be super annoyed by a chatty kid at the theater. And on Slate Plus I’ll talk more about an announcement I’m making on today’s show. If you want to hear that conversation join us on Slate Plus at Slate dot com slash mom and dad.

S4: Plus now onto the show.

S5: Before we begin I thought I would point out that several listeners on the Facebook page to last week’s episode thought that I was a little jelly that I was a little angry last week that I was yelling at dads too much. Some people were like why why or why are they yelling. They also point to your yelling the week before when you were you how you got exercised about a few things and then also several dads were like Dan you’re being you’re being too mean to dads when you literally say fuck that Dad you’re.

S6: Now I would counter that the show is not called Mom and Dad are soothing. The show is called Mom Dad are fighting. So we do yell some sometimes but I’m gonna try Rebecca to tone it down this week a little I’m gonna try not to yell and I’m going to be nice to dads should the occasion arise.

S7: Yes because that’s what men need is special attention and people to be nicer to them.

S8: I mean I love it when people are writing me. Rebecca. I don’t think I should treat other dads any differently than I would like to be treated myself okay.

S7: I’m fine with the yelling. I do think the show is called Mom and Dad are fighting for a reason and I did not think that you were over the top in your declarations of FUCK THAT DAD TO THAT DAD BECAUSE I FELT THE SAME WAY. So I appreciate you responding to the audience’s needs though that’s very audience centric view and that’s always good.

S9: We’ll see. We’ll see if I can make it through a whole show without yelling. I can’t wait to find out.

S10: Well I have something that I wanted to talk about before we did triumphs and fables if that’s OK. Dad Absolutely. Well at the end of this month I will be stepping away as our regular host of Mom and Dad are fighting for a variety of roles. Yes it’s true.

S11: But I do hope to still be on occasionally as a pinch hitter I believe in Soap Opera Land that’s called bumping yourself down to recurring status and I will talk about that more in Slate Plus what went into that decision and we can just like chat about it a little bit. But yes it’s happening. I am stepping away as a regular person on this podcast. Dan now you’ll have one for your person to like worry about whether or not they yell.

S9: I mean I’m sure we’ll hire a yeller to replace you but I still don’t think they’ll truly be able to replace your yelling which has world caliber.

S12: Thanks. Thank you. My kids wouldn’t agree. But anyway I appreciate the compliment. All right do you have a dream for fail this week.

S13: DAN KOIS I have a fail. It is sort of a parenting fail. More broadly it is a parenting life. Culinary and career fail. It really hits the four quadrants of failure. So this weekend I was in my hometown the place I grew up beautiful Milwaukee Wisconsin a great place by a great lake doing a book reading at a bookstore on the east side. And while I was in Milwaukee this thing happened which happens to characters in movies and in wire novels and stuff. But I never thought would happen to me but my past caught up with me. So after the reading my dad and his wife wanted to take us all the cops and the kids were at the reading they actually participated in the reading wonderfully. They did a lovely job. They want to take us to cops which is the world’s tastiest frozen custard stand and I really wanted to go.

S14: Obviously it’s a delicious place to get frozen custard and in fact I hadn’t eaten dinner and I really wanted a burger but due to an error I made 12 years ago I can no longer comfortably go to cops frozen custard on Silver Spring Avenue in Milwaukee Wisconsin. So what happened was way back in 2010. There was no sorry that early on that what happened was way back in 2007. A manager at cops frozen custard due to like a series of events. As is always the case became a like minor Fox News hero for like 20 minutes for like two segments on Fox News.

S6: He’s like very briefly in the news and that manager was once my boss.

S9: In fact he was my nemesis when I worked at cops in like 1994 or maybe even earlier like nineteen ninety three. It was there as a long time ago and that manager was once my boss. In fact he was my nemesis. When I worked at cops and like 1990 or 91 like my junior year in high school and he still was working there then at the time I worked for New York Magazine the NY Mag dot com. It was my first real journalism job. After several years doing other stuff and my job was to write blog posts as quickly as possible so I wrote a snarky blog post about this guy and cops and like 10 minutes. I just immediately stopped thinking about it went on to write the other 12 to 14 blog post I had to write that day but so then the next time I was in Milwaukee maybe six months later I went to cops and I ordered a malt. And then when my number came up I went up to the counter and it was him at the counter holding the malt and he looked right in my eyes and he said I saw that thing you wrote and I.

S8: Didn’t say anything. And I took them all. And I left the restaurant and I threw them all in the garbage can. Yeah.

S6: And how it’s eleven years later and every time I go to Milwaukee all I want to do is go to cops. But he works Saturday nights I guess because every time I go there on a Saturday night there he is at the counter like waiting for me. And so that I just turn around and leave. Or I send my kids up to order and I hide behind a pillar. I can’t like face him because he knows what I wrote.

S8: He read the thing I wrote.

S6: So this weekend my dad wanted us all to go to cops have to hike for a celebratory family evening with his grandchildren and his son of whom he was so proud that I just couldn’t face the whole fucking thing so I just told my dad you know I’d take the kids take him the cops have a great time I’ll drive Mom home Oh I’ll see you later. So I missed one old retiree frozen custard. I miss this like great family event. It would’ve been so delicious that would have been meaningful and moving but I blew it.

S9: All right how about you. You ever tried for a fail this week.

S7: I’m gonna try. It’s a sad one. I know I tease this a little bit last week that this was going to happen but we did have to put our dog down since the last time we recorded together our young our older smaller dog Brady and we had a lot of back and forth. My husband and I we actually got into a huge argument last week when it was very clear that she was definitely dying and it was just a matter of like whether or not we put her down and it’s like peaceful and cool. Or maybe she just craters and has like a horrible painful traumatic death at home and then we have to take her like the emergency veterinarian to get it. But I’ve been through the latter before. So I felt very confident that putting her down kind of proactively while she still had like a little bit of herself left in herself was the right thing to do. He felt very strongly that he wanted to get a chance for his daughter to come home from college and for Teddy to be around and our argument was basically just like if we even if we wait a day or two like that horrible trauma could happen and then I’ll be pissed that like we were selfish about just not putting this poor dog down anyway it all worked out. We sort of compromise we decided to do it very early Saturday morning and you know my stepdaughter came home from college night before and we had like a perfect night with the dog and it was really wonderful. And then we all went together and had her put down and it was so sad. And my son Teddy who is by the way I don’t know if I’ve ever said this in the show like He’s gigantic like he’s like he’s he’s he’s only like five 10 or five eleven but he’s one of those people like he just is a huge head and like big arms and big legs like he looks like a giant person even though he’s not super tall and he looks very you know he looks very much in that sort of second half of puberty like you can tell within like he’s a man kind of. Right. And he had a complete emotional breakdown at the vet was crying hysterically like in hysterics was so sad. And it was so I was actually in a way we all agreed later. Much harder to see his breakdown than it was to put our dog down like it was. It was sadder because like the real the real life impact of it was just so visceral. But the triumph of it is is that afterword. We know we kind of sat for a while and then we went to downtown Concord that has like a farmer’s market every Saturday and we did some walking around and we met tons of dogs because it’s like the kind of town people like bring their dogs out on Saturday.

S4: And we had all these like long talks about like what Brady had meant to us and how dogs are so worth it because you get so much love. And it ended up just being like really really in a weird way beautiful and fun like we had a really really good day like a healing bonding day.

S7: And my son had had this huge breakdown and he’d been really afraid to go and like sort of his worst case scenario happened where like he’d had this big breakdown but then he like got through it and we kind of all agreed later including him that it would have been if he hadn’t gone and had that like cathartic big breakdown that he could have been like that for days and not gone through the whole arc of like saying goodbye to her and then being with the family and like walking around and going to get breakfast together and like all the stuff we did like our whole day was basically structured around the fact that we’d done this hard thing and we ended up having like a wonderful wonderful day together very healing day and I’m just really proud of him and proud of being the kind of kid that like is comfortable crying hysterically in a public place like I felt I did feel kind of bad for the poor people who were just there to get their cats like shots or whatever. It’s like a kid in the in the waiting room but it was really great. And I’m super proud of him and it ended up being kind of a triumph even though it was a super sad day for our family while rest in peace.

S14: Brady I’m sorry for your loss but I’m glad that that dog had a long and great life with you guys.

S15: Thanks. We are too. She was really great actually. To be honest she kind of sucked its ducks go but we loved her a lot. She puts time to tell the truth about even your love even the sucky dogs.

S12: Exactly. That’s so great about him. All right let’s do some business Slate’s parenting newsletter is the very best place to be notified about all of our parenting content including Mom and Dad are fighting care and feeding.

S7: Ask a teacher and much more. And it’s like getting a personal email from Dan Kois. I really like it. You can sign up at Slate dot com slash parenting email. As always if you have a question you want us to answer on the podcast. Leave us a message at 4 2 4 2 5 5 7 8 3 3. Or you can email us at mom and dad at Slate dot com. And your question could get read by the amazing Shashank Leon are also. Check out our Facebook group. Just search for Slate parenting on Facebook. It’s a fun community and we moderate the heck out of it so it doesn’t get out of control even I kick people out of the Facebook group in Slate Plus today an in-depth explanation of why I’m stepping down as one of the co-hosts of Mom and Dad are fighting. Here’s a little taste of that conversation. It doesn’t feel great as I feel like I’m doing my best work but also makes me sort of wonder like whether it’s not time to bring in like a different parent to tackle some of these issues to give a different perspective to hear segments like that and to get ad free podcasts sign up for our membership program Slate Plus. It’s a great way to support the show for just 35 dollars for your first year. You can help cover the cost of producing Mom and Dad are fighting and your other favorite Slate shows and in return you’ll get extended ad free versions of this show and other slate shows and a ton of other great perks so support mom and dad are fighting. Go to Slate dot com slash mom and dad plus and join Slate Plus today.

S9: OK back to the show before we go back to the show I would like to reinforce one of those announcements which is send us questions. We really please. We are. We had a shortage of questions this week in part because we recorded a little earlier than usual. But if you like listening to the podcast send us something that’s been bugging you about parenting or something you’d like us to talk about her an issue you want to raise. It can be an advice style question or it can just be something about parenting issue that you’ve been thinking about a lot but we really want to hear from you because we want the show to reflect what you our listeners want to hear from us like less yelling and other questions. So let’s say dot com do it.

S16: You won’t regret it.

S7: All right our first listener question for this show. This one was sent by email to Mom and Dad. It’s late dot com and it’s being read for us by Sasha Lamarr.

S17: My daughter is 6 and I am 33 weeks pregnant. She’s really excited about the imminent arrival of her new sibling. I told her how babies get nutrients from breast milk or formula milk and that at least for a little while the baby will probably be breastfeeding as she did as a baby. I enjoyed breastfeeding the first time round so we’ll probably give it a go again recently. She asked me if she would be able to taste my breast milk. I said yes but not from my breast and that I put some in a cup for her. My husband and I both tried it this way the first time around just out of curiosity when I casually mentioned this to a friend yesterday they were horrified that I would even consider letting my daughter taste it. So am I a weirdo. Should I have a boundary around my breast milk thanks Dan.

S7: I have thoughts but I’ve just been talking for two straight minutes so I’d love for you to share your thoughts first and then I will share my thoughts.

S13: I don’t think that this is like a real issue.

S14: Like I just I think there’s no reason to have boundaries are under breastmilk. There’s no reason to worry about letting your kid taste your breast milk. There’s like breast milk is just a food that babies eat. And it is slightly weird that it comes out of your boob. But nonetheless we all have had it almost all of us and. And I think that like the value of normalizing for your kid that this is a thing that women mothers often do that it’s a thing that babies eat that it’s just a totally natural part of your body and not anything to like hide or be ashamed of or to feel weird about far outweighs any sort of queasiness about my kids drinking something that came out of my body. I just think that like the like the ability to give that to your daughter is actually pretty valuable and not really that weird at all. And you I encourage you to get over any weirdness that you might feel but that leads me to a broader question which is and I want to hear what you have to say about it Rebecca but I also want to know like Rebecca did everyone in your family taste your breast milk.

S8: And I’ll tell you what happened in our family.

S7: I don’t remember of everyone I know I did. I was super curious you know and I was like You know I did not have any luck breastfeeding either of the kids so I pumped for a couple of months. So I always had like these like big bags of milk like it. Yeah. It’s not like that. Yeah. And you know just like the latching on just was not did not happen with either one of my kids. And but you know I pumped for a couple months with both and of course I was curious. And it’s interesting to me that there would even like I mean you talked about it like being a little weird that it comes out of your boob.

S12: It’s only weird because we’ve decided it’s weird it’s not weird. I mean milk comes out of somebodies boob no matter what kind. Milk is like their point cows milk comes out of a cow boob goat milk comes back of a goat boob and it’s just arbitrary that we’ve you know or that apparently this woman’s friend has decided that there should be some sort of weird boundary about it.

S7: I mean I understand like you might not want to say like hey why don’t you just start having breast milk on your cereal from now on kid because it is you know for the baby and it’s not for everyone. There might be some stuff there and there might be some health issues that I don’t know about that I’m just kind of talking you know out of my boob about butter.

S12: I would just like to state for that I think there are right there. Exactly right. I mean this is I think it’s weird that somebody would think this was weird and if you are friends with somebody that thinks it’s weird I’m not going to yell but fuck that friends. No it’s not weird.

S7: You shouldn’t have boundaries around your breast milk. You should talk about it openly. You should raise the kind of kids that have no discomfort when they see a mother feeding her child in a public place or on a train or in a theater or anywhere else at work that they decide to do it. You should have total and complete comfort about it. It’s a wonderful value to pass along and you should let your daughter taste it whenever or however she wants to out of a cup. Whatever you decide is appropriate and it’s fine it’s completely fine you’re not hurting anybody and you’re not you know doing anything wrong here. But yeah of course I tasted mine it was you know I don’t like remember much about it. I don’t think anyone else did. I think it was pretty much just me. I was curious.

S8: I definitely tasted as best as did at one point.

S14: So what happened was it was like maybe a month after Lara was born and her brother came to visit and he was like Well I have you a taste of the breast milk yet and I was like No but I really want to. He was like I want. Well what does it taste like. I want to know too. So we both tasted it. We had like a little sample it was like a shot glass with a little bit in and we didn’t tell Alia that we were doing it because that was the point where for her nursing also was very difficult. She also had supply issues. And so like every drop that she pumped out of progress was like gold but she had said that she produced by the toil of her brow. And so if she had known that we were like stealing some out of those Mandela bags and doing shots she would have been like that was like an hour of work you just consumed. Well how could you do that to me. But I remember I can still like summon to my mind that flavor like right now. It was a very striking flavor and I recommend anyone who has wondered about it to like give it a try you’ll never taste anything like it.

S13: But I was so glad that I did it and tried it. What do you say to that friend to the friend who is horrified. I don’t I mean I don’t like. I’m not exactly at fault that friend but I do agree that it’s like weird or that the friend was had an opinion and expressed it to you that it is that you were thinking about doing it in the first place. And I think it’s worth going back to the front and be like hey when you were horrified I made me second guess myself. But with the help of my friends and Mom and Dad are fighting. I have been thinking about this and I really think that it’s not weird and that it’s valuable to give my child this experience that she’s interested in and that to tell me it’s weird is like a way of marginalizing this totally human thing.

S7: And I think that is like specific to women. So there’s like a huge undercurrent of sexism here too that you know is kind of just around the whole breastfeeding conversation generally like the idea that we’d be eked out by any part of it is problematic.

S12: I think it’s worth circling around that friend too because if you want to stay friends with his person you know when you have kids and you talk about parenting stuff like I think it’s important to be comfortable with who you are. Or maybe just learn that you have a kind of friendship where you just can’t talk about real shit. Some friendships are like that you know. All right. Well we’d love to hear what happens. What is your what is your 6 year old think of the breast milk for now. I think we should move on to our next question. This one also came in by e-mail and it’s also being read by Sasha Leon.

S17: Dear Mom and Dad are fighting. I recently attended a theater performance for a national touring company of a Broadway production. The show is child themed but the ticket prices were not insignificant at eighty five dollars per seat. I was seated two seats from the aisle directly next to a young boy with the female adult accompanying him seated on the aisle during the first half of the performance. The child spoke frequently and the woman engaged with him every time after the child was quietly listening attentively to the performance and the adult would start a dialogue with the child. This went on for the entire first half of the performance. I did manage to catch the adults eyes once while she was happily chattering away. At which point she managed to quiet down for a matter of moments. The child who I was later informed was 6 was also unable to remain seated without a lot of fidgeting during the fidgeting I was kicked multiple times and elbowed in the head repeatedly at the beginning of the intermission I turned to my teenage daughter and asked her if she would switch seats with me. Curly having observed what was going on she refused. I then said something to the effect of what you don’t think you’d enjoy being repeatedly kicked and elbowed and having constant chatter. In response the adult to my right raised her voice to tell me I was a miserable human and should have done everyone a favor by staying home. The child was 6. The performance was for children and I should grow up. I simply laughed in response because her tone and volume indicated that there was no opportunity for a recent discussion. When I did attempt to respond she simply raised her voice over me. The second half went better for me and worse for the people seated in front of the pair. Should I have been more accepting of the child’s behavior or should I have had some expectation that I not have my theater experience impaired by a parent who models poor behavior thanks aggravated analogy.

S16: Dan Coats. I know you’ve got thoughts go lady.

S8: I did a little research.

S5: I believe that I have identified the Broadway tour that you attended at the proctors Theatre in Albany New York. The show that you spent one hundred seventy dollars on for two tickets for you and your teenage daughter. The show that was ruined for you by a 6 year old fidgeting. That show was the SpongeBob musical a show about a children’s cartoon character SpongeBob Square Pants wow now look kid detective work. Look I understand that sometimes kids out in the world are a drag. It sucks to have a baby cry next to you on a plane. It sucks to be at a restaurant and have a kid talking loudly at the next table. And if it sucks for you I just urge you not to worry. Pretty much every parent is keenly aware of how much the world resents their presence anywhere when they have small children. That’s why they look so miserable on the plane. That’s why they keep shushing their kid at the restaurant table and then they distract them with a phone and then they don’t say anything when you’re like oh those shitty parents just given their baby a phone. How dare they. But you have this experience right. Rebecca when you were a parent with small kids you would go out in public to a place where you know what you just got to be there in public with your kid because we live in a society and your kid would be acting like a kid and you would be like mortified and doing your fucking damnedest to like get the kid to behave because you know that people are pissed right Yeah And it’s interesting that you track down what the show is.

S7: I do think that contextually that makes a difference. I really do but also I mean just what really struck me about this email was think we can agree that sometimes you’re next to either you know at an event or a public place next to you like a kid who is not behaving great but also like a parent who’s not doing great in like their self-awareness about how their kid is being which I think is like the trigger for this person is that the mother wasn’t like try wasn’t being apologetic about it right. She wasn’t like oh she felt like she was like participating in the disruption and that was sort of the aggravating factor. But what’s interesting to me about this kind of situation is when you find yourself in it you actually do have a choice and that choice is really like you can be a good and patient understanding person or you can be a jackal right. And it does bother me that this person who you know paid money for this ticket and was so aggravated and angry by the experience of sitting next to this family the way they wanted to handle it was to put their teenage child in the very seat that was such an irritating place to be like Ben or her that he tells me Yeah. It basically tells me is that like it’s kind of like it that that moment like it’s about you and your enjoyment and sort of the lack of awareness that you actually could be a good and helpful person by being tolerant and smiling and maybe politely saying to the monitoring intermission Oh my gosh you guys are so chatty. I totally get it. You know I’m a little hard of hearing but I would never ask you to like you know not being good.

S4: I’m so glad your kid is here but it’s f why I would be like take it down a decibel that would be really great I really appreciate and be apologetic and there are ways to kind of address people but I promise you like this parent knows and it’s it’s a whole thing and and this sort of decision to be angry and to like throw your teenage kid to the slaughter by instead of just being like a kind of buffer. That was a choice you made and I feel the same way on airplanes like crying babies like babies can not fucking help it on air by can’t help it they are babies and when people get mad at babies it makes me so mad cause I’m like again you have a choice you can be patient and just understand that flying is frickin awful and weird for babies and they will cry and we all did it cause we were all babies once and you can smile and you can give them Mom sympathetic looks and ask if you can help and you can be cool and you can not be an asshole about it. That is a choice you get to make in the moment. And I do think aggravated an Albany perhaps made the wrong choice. I’m not saying the feelings were wrong. You can’t help how you feel but you know the response I think was a little much.

S5: Now you may be listening aggravated in Albany and you may be like these people don’t understand but I would like you to think about it at least for a minute. From the mom’s point of view right. You are a mom taking your child to a musical maybe his first ever musical. You also paid eighty five dollars per ticket for the seats. The musical is about SpongeBob Square Pants. A beloved cartoon character on Nickelodeon. You are trying to engage your child through this children’s entertainment here. I’m sure also doing your best to keep him from fidgeting. You have no desire for him to hit people sitting next to him and then at intermission some woman sitting next to your kid loudly announces to everyone around you in the guise of talking to her teenager how your child is just awful and is behaving awfully. You hear it your kid hears it everyone around you hears it. If this was you and this was remember when your teenager was 6 and this was her your 6 year old how would you feel if someone did that to your daughter. Would you feel like your child’s experience had been somewhat ruined that someone had taken out their frustrations over totally normal 6 year old behavior at an entertainment event meant for 6 year olds on your kid and like spoiled this evening you spent a shitload of money on like you would be very upset and you you know and reporting this to us you said that the woman said you’re a miserable human and you should’ve done everyone a favor by staying home.

S6: That’s a harsh response but I totally understand that response because I cannot stress enough to you lady. You were not at slave play you were not angels in America you were not even like Oklahoma you were at the SpongeBob fuckin square pants musical a show for children and you got all pissed off about a 6 year old behaving like a totally normal 6 year old.

S8: Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Yeah. Rebecca is right. You have the right to be aggravated.

S6: Everyone has the right to be aggravated. This is America. Though I would encourage you to relax but you are absolutely wrong to complain loudly about it. You were wrong that mom was right. You should have done everyone a favor and stayed home.

S12: All right. Now it’s time for the part of the podcast where we share something we like something our kids like something our whole family likes. Yes it is time for recommendations. Dan what is your recommendation for our listeners this week were a name for this segment.

S13: I recommend cops frozen custard in Milwaukee Wisconsin a wonderful place to go with your family on a Saturday night. I recommend the chocolate malt every day they have a flavor of the day a different flavor in addition to the chocolate and vanilla custard. They already make by hand at every location. There are I believe four locations around the Milwaukee area. They have great burgers. They have a great this month actually October the October Sunday of the month is the Carmel Apple. Sunday it’s delicious. Can’t recommend cups frozen custard enough how about you Rebecca.

S10: That’s great. That’s really nice of you. You’re doing your due diligence and making up for you know your behavior a few years ago. Yeah I’m going to recommend something that’s objectively awful and that I hate but that my kids like really like two of my kids in particular like Teddy and Lily like Henry just also agrees that it’s awful.

S7: And by the way Teddy and Lily like it ironically they also agree that it’s awful but they have a hell of a lot of fun watching it and that is this terrible terrible TV show on the Travel Channel called Ghost Adventures in which this hapless dude named Zach who is maybe the worst broadcaster in the history of television and his band of weirdo friends investigate hauntings at buildings and old houses and they do that thing where they like have those those instruments where they collect like audio from the room and they play it back and it just sounds like but they’re like did you hear that. The ghost said get out and it’s just like. Like of course you can’t hear because it didn’t happen.

S10: But like it’s objectively awful. And my kids frickin love watching it together and apparently like a lot of their teenage friends also love watching this show it’s like they like the absurdity of it. They like the structure of it. They like the weird obviously kind of fake portions of it. But anyway yes that’s a Ghost Adventures on the Travel Channel. Objectively awful. But teens really seem to like it. So that is my recommendation of this week and I do like watching it with them because they they don’t like it to the extent where like if we make fun of it like they’re not insulted by it.

S18: I mean it’s bad it’s real bad. And I can’t recommend it highly enough.

S8: Ghost Adventures that’s the greatest recommendation I highly recommend this terrible thing.

S9: I’m glad that you’ve taught your kids or maybe they just picked it up through the other ironic appreciation.

S12: I thought that that kind of shit died with Gen X but I’m glad that it’s all I know I didn’t it didn’t good another experience we had this weekend with TV was Lily is watching that old Showtime series The Tudors oh she was watching it in our living room and I don’t know if you’ve ever seen like a minute of that show Dad it’s a you’re right like softcore pornography like so much ridiculous sex up against trees like it’s crazy and yeah. So that is not my recommendation for this week to not watch the Tudors with your kids but to watch the objectively terrible with your kids just no nudity none.

S19: All right. That is our show. Again if you have a question you want to ask us please do that leave us a message at 4 2 4 2 5 5 7 8 3 3 or email us at mom and dad it’s late AECOM and join us on Facebook just search for Slate parenting their mom and dad are fighting is produced by Jess Jupiter and Rebecca Lavoy and Dan Kois. It was awful nice talking to you this week thanks. Thank you.

S3: Hello Slate Plus members. Welcome to the Slate Plus bonus segment. Mom and Dad are fighting.

S6: We’re so happy to have you here and we’re so grateful for the support that you give to Slate by being members of Slate Plus today. I want to grill Rebecca Lavoy about her foolhardy decision to step away from Mom and Dad are fighting America’s best podcast in favor of apparently other work responsibilities or something I don’t understand. I’m going to find out what’s up Rebecca. Well thank you for joining me on the slate plus sinking bonus segment. Here’s my first question for you. Is it because you don’t like me.

S8: No. Although that would be really fun. Yes it would be way better for me. That’s right. So we can tease that in the episode. Yes. Yes I don’t. Because

S10: I don’t like you. Perfect. I don’t like anything about you. I think you’re a terrible parent I should be giving anybody advice. No it’s not because I don’t like you Dan although you know I was in the weird position of being like the Mariska Hargitay of the show where like I was left for a while. And I do kind of feel like we are just kind of getting our groove as co-hosts and you know that did not play into my decision at all. You add as a human being at all at all. So no it’s not because I don’t like you I do like you Dan I like you a lot.

S14: I do agree that we’re just getting into our groove as co-hosts and so I’m glad to hear that you will be popping by now and that I’m hoping I can lure you back every month or two to visit us and do another episode. But tell us a little about what’s going on up at your station that is leading your life to become a much busier than they used to be.

S7: Well there are a couple of things going on. Some of them are professional like this time every four years my job does get super busy because I work in New Hampshire and journalism and we have a lot of things to do related to the New Hampshire primary. And so I run the digital news operation at my public radio station and it’s a lot of work. We also have a new CEO coming in and a couple weeks and someone have a new boss and it’s just gonna be like require a lot of focus. But I think mostly I made this decision because you know I had to take a little bit of time off when I had my leg surgery and I realized listening to the podcast that I when I wasn’t on it that the answers I would have given to some of the questions you guys tackled like I’ve already given those answers before like I’ve reached a point I’ve been doing this for a few years where I feel like I am where we’re coming full circle. If I find myself sort of giving the same responses to questions and I you know it’s it’s it’s it doesn’t feel great. I don’t feel like I’m doing my best work but also makes me sort of wonder like whether it’s not time to bring in like a different parent to tackle some of these issues to give a different perspective. And so it was partially that it’s partially the professional staff my podcast business is there’s been really busy this whole time and is just continuing to be really busy I’m getting more gigs you know guest hosting podcasts elsewhere that are just sort of like naw neither here nor there and it’s just a lot and when I looked at sort of the whole portfolio of everything that I’m doing and seeing the fact that I am not certain I’ll be able to bring new and fresh stuff to this show every week it felt like if there was a thing that I should step away from it made sense to step away from this. But it has nothing to do with my enjoyment of being on this podcast and the people at Slate. I adore every single one of them to a person. It’s not any of that stuff. It’s purely like a combination of professional and personal stuff and as you know it’s been a tough year. My husband had cancer this year we just found out he’s all clear just five minutes ago I got a text message confirming that you know I had the broken leg things just been like a lot going on my son going to college. And and it is increasingly difficult to commit to gigs that are like weekly that take a couple of hours that are kind of outside my wheelhouse. I hope that makes sense.

S14: It does. That’s very good. Slate Plus bonus content you slipped in there joint Slate Plus to find the results of Rebecca’s husband’s most recent cancer diagnosis.

S20: How is the screening joint Slate Plus.

S14: I totally understand everything you’re saying even as I disagree strongly with the notion that you were starting to repeat herself. I’m certainly not believing that to be the case. I feel you bring fresh outrage every week to some new question that we get. It is like slightly frustrating to me though as a longtime host on this podcast with breaks that you are now the third host of this show. We have lost basically specifically because they keep getting promoted within an organization and become too important. They are now too important to do the show. First I happened to Allison Benedikt who just like got promoted like a fucking rocket at Slate. Now she basically runs the joint and then she was too busy that happened to Gabe who he just got promoted and promoted and promoted and now he runs all podcasts at Slate and then he ditched Carl left for professional reasons as well. But it was like his own that he was writing a book and he was doing other stuff but it wasn’t just like some stupid organization kept promoting him so many times that he couldn’t do this important thing anymore and now you you like run all of an HP are and you can’t do this anymore and I find I mean well I didn’t get promoted Dan like I just I just am like my job is just get like this is a time where it gets intense like we’re just doing a lot like we buy before we take this podcast we had a presidential candidate in my office and I was like running the video which and then I had to be like Oh.

S10: Oh it was. It was. It was Bill Weld. It was a very old truck. I mean he’s not even my bad but we had to do the video. The TV partnership and all that stuff.

S15: Anyway it’s all we want a real candidate in your office and you can leave.

S10: I won’t tell Governor Weld staff that you said that I think they’re still over in our greenroom but.

S4: But yeah you know did you ever like find yourself and this is gonna sound.

S18: I hope that you take this on intention which I mean do you ever find yourself like when you have to take time off from something you realize how hard it is to do even though it’s just part of your routine and it and you and you think it’s easy and like that’s how the show was for me like it was just something I did. We usually tape it on the same day at the same time and it takes a chunk of that day and sort of the prepping for it and thinking about it. And when I wasn’t doing it for a few weeks consistently I realized that it was actually occupying more bandwidth than I necessarily had.

S11: And I was actually doing other things not as well as results of of this.

S7: And if I felt like I was essential for it or I felt like it wouldn’t exist without me it might be a different conversation. But the show existed long before me and will continue to exist without me and be great and I am not actually like leaving person. I mean you know I’m a new back person so I would like to stay connected to it. I just can’t stay committed to doing it every week. That’s kind of where I’m at right now.

S14: I interestingly almost have the exact opposite thing happen to me all the time which is that while I’m doing something I just endlessly bitch and groan about how hard it is how much time it takes and I’m gonna have to do this fucking thing again. And then when I leave it I was like Oh I miss it. That wasn’t that much work. That’s exactly how it was the podcast when I left to go on the trip.

S6: I was like You know I’d been doing it for a year and a half and I was like oh it takes so much time that I left I was like oh I could absolutely spend two hours of my day talking about parenting like what the hell it’s just talking yeah.

S8: So I can’t wait for you to come to that realization a year from now and come crawling back I hope you’ll have me if I do. I really do. We absolutely will. We’ll have you more frequently more soon than that. I hope we won’t miss you.

S14: Rebecca you’re gonna be sticking on full time through the end of the month. So a couple more shows. That’s right. And then I will definitely hear from you from time to time after that in between your important interviews of like fucking Marianne Williamson or whatever.

S8: Thank you so much. Slate Plus members for being members of our club you’re the first to hear the moms. Dan you just lost them. Every mom signed off to this show every California listener just to just cancel their slate plus membership.

S14: Thank you for being a member of a positive means a lot to us that you support us unlike some quitters. See you later.