Stern Men and Power Femmes

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S1: Bill popped open and pulled out. Can I eat this? He asked. I insist that you do. I replied.

S2: Oh, OK. Hi, Bill. Well. Bill, not me. OK.

S3: Hello. Hi, Nicole. How are you? I’m good. How are you?

S4: I’m good. I have a new hairstyle and this wonderful West African Breda mismatched not just my edges, but perhaps also my eyebrows or maybe even my soul. Yeah. But I look cute.

S5: So it’s what? It’s cute. I like it. Yeah. How about you? How you doing?


S6: I don’t know. I got a vacation coming that I am both excited about, but dreading. So I’m just like, you know, but I’m I’m going to pack and just zone out and get ready for it.

S4: That’s the whole point of the vacation. You go there feeling somehow and then you come back feeling just one way. And that’s good.

S7: I’m hoping to get some rest and get rid of these bags under my eyes. OK. And may actually get eight hours of sleep one night.

S4: Cool. I’m gonna. Not even say one single suggestive thing. A little Billie Holiday. They come back to me refreshed and raring to go. I’m going to try my best. Marvelous. Let’s talk about today’s show.


S8: Yes, I’m very excited because we have one of my favorite people in the whole wide world.

S9: And it is our first guest. Yes. Which is very exciting. Yeah. I’ve been doing this as a two hander all this time, lol. I said it because I meant it. But no two hands any longer.


S10: We have a guest and our guest is, of course, Nicole Cliff. To Nicole’s one studio. Yes. The sequel to Two Girls One Cup. I don’t.

S7: She is a writer, advice columnist and a fantastic Twitter personality. She is the co-founder of The Toast and is currently one of the columnist for Slate’s Care and Feeding Parenting column. And she’s also a thirsty mother of three because motherhood does not stop thirst.


S9: Preach it again and again. Yeah. Welcome. Nicole calls. So good to be here.

S11: You right. One of the care and feeding columns on a regular basis. Talk to us a little bit about that.

S12: I love it. I love it so much. Also, because I don’t like being criticized at anyway, who does read? And anytime I really read someone out, which is rare, like usually I’m pretty sympathetic to people who writing because also like it’s a vulnerable thing, especially like when you’re a parent raising a child to be like, hey, am I doing this right? Like, it’s a very vulnerable thing. And if I’m usually very nice to people, but sometimes I need to be like, you are messing up your child. And those people never write back. You know, which I think is. I like ideally they took something from that. Right. Fingers crossed. Fingers crossed. Yeah. But I love doing it. My editor, I rarely disagree. Last week he had a strong disagreement over a question. And we went back and forth on it a little bit. And he was like, just add a little more. And I did. And then I pulled the like, I have a vagina. It was a menstruation question.


S3: Farrah was like, don’t don’t try it. Yeah, that’s the. Yeah, that’s entirely fair. It was entirely. And is he a parent, too? Yes. OK. He’s a great parent. OK.


S13: So I see that you go leniency. Trust me. Trust yourself the way you trusted me. Beyond care and feeding.

S14: You also have what is known perhaps as the eighth wonder of the world, which is essentially one of the finest was her accounts out there.

S12: Nicole, Cliff, thank you. I am very good at Twitter.

S15: I mean, I don’t want to. Yeah, you are like. It’s not even a case of like, this is not a big hair. This is just fact. And then what makes it so?


S11: What makes you so good at Twitter is the fact that you boost other people frequently and you are constantly like sharing other people’s thoughts. So we’re not just seeing what you think. You’re retweeting other people. You’re asking people to share their experiences if they feel comfortable.

S12: And that’s fantastic. I’m genuinely very interested to other people. And because of that, I find other peoples thoughts fascinating and I genuinely want to hear them. And I think you can tell the difference when people are like thoughts versus like, no, I would like to know how other humans have experienced this thing or like what that journey in their life has been like. Yes. I think that you can.


S15: And what I really enjoy is, like I said, like the natural nosiness that you have, you have an interest and you want to put your nose into everything. And I’m like, blessed. She is trying out there just to gather all the information. And I love that. So nosy. You know, this is a good thing. Nosiness is good. It’s what makes us human. Like, you know, I want to know what else is going on.


S12: And my, my. Followers are so great that, I mean, I can do things like one day I said, please, if you have a celebrity gossip story, drop it. My dear Ms. I’m gonna open em for like half an hour. And there is enough sitting in there that I do think in my will I have to leave someone my idea, so I can share it with the world.


S8: I have I have text it. Do you like OK, can you look through your Gassot files and tell me about this person? Because I wanted to check and make sure that they weren’t horrible. And Nicole will come back. Like, no, he’s good. No, it’s OK. Heard nothing bad.

S15: Or sometimes like it was just very sad. Let’s not do that. Well, Nicole, you have this rare gift spotting good things, which is why you’re here this week to talk with us about a very specific set of the kinks that kind of tie all your first objects together.

S12: Tell us about that Nicole 0th. So we like if we had to call it something that would be sternman and power fems like that’s just uh-huh, that’s just what does it for me. I’m a bisexual lady. Just the way you said that I’m a my sexual lady sounds so delicious. It’s funny because so I did the toast as. Yeah, well that for ages and ages and you know I I never even though our audience would’ve been so incredibly welcoming of this, like I just did talk about it all, which I think is just like a residual Hang-Up thing that so many people see us because we live in a homophobic culture which is improving but like is still a thing.

S3: OK, so you identify as a bisexual lady. It’s fantastic. I just love that. It’s so dainty with so cute.

S16: And that is why you are here to talk about Sternman and Power fans. When did you realize that these were the ideas that did it for you?

S12: Oh, like day one. I remember, like the Babar books as a child. I kind of had this thing for a Texas. You know, like the mean rhinoceros only. And nothing has changed. I mean, rhino did it for you. I mean, Rhino did it for me. radway was like that guy. What’s he like? I wonder what he’s like. This is in her life.


S17: Is he like this, his personal relationships?

S15: Tell me about your horn. Yes. No, that makes a lot of sense of. So that was your initial kind of. How did that progress?

S12: Hopefully it progressed. OK. Listen. I am no longer interested in rhinoceros ex-gay as a species. OK, good. No. So it just I would say that. And so in high school in particular, my friend and I would watch what we’re in retrospect, extremely like gay films with very tough ladies in them. So we’re talking like the early Angelina Jolie days. Gia girl interrupted that stuff. But I’m a cheerleader. Yeah.

S5: And all these good things which we featured in our life show. Yeah. Our very first love show that we do the greenspace a go back and find that episode. Alex Jones did a very good job of explaining the ILIR of that film. So all that to say we get you.


S12: Yes. You get me. Yeah. Drop dead gorgeous shot, which I appreciated on a different level perhaps than some other people. And then the X-Files like hit real hard on TV, on TV. And as a Canadian show, you know, everything is shot in Canada for The X-Files. So it doesn’t matter whether they claim they are in Maine or whether they claim they are in Arizona. It is always in British Columbia exclusively. Like the ocean will be on the wrong side. And all the extras on it are like there’s a like Ryan Gosling is on an early episode of The X-Files and doesn’t even get like a name like like ritualistically murdered within the first two minutes. So you spot like all of these random Canadians right now. Gillian Anderson just destroyed me. What was it about her that so decimated you? So we talk a lot. We thirst buckets in general, talk about, you know, competency. Kink is a big thing. And Jillian Broad, like as Scully brought the most like of the time, competency kink into it. Yeah. Like Mulder was just running around into trees saying nonsense. Yeah. Doing silly thing. Yeah, she was the one. Obviously, people are sort of like Scully. Are we still six seasons in being like, did a demon really do this fair? But anytime, like, I don’t know that white lab coat when she would like put on her like doctor stuff. And, you know, I remember that I am a doctor. Yeah. And like, cut into something. I was just like sent. I was sent. And you would know probably them. But the Welsh band catatonia.


S9: Harry’s Matthew. Yeah. Yeah.

S12: shadows. the cares I had the song, Mulder and Scully. Great song. And this girl I was so in love with and my choir made me a mix tape. Oh, wow. Oh, yeah, true love. I don’t know if in my life I will ever be in love again. As much as I was incredibly hot women in my choir who made me the catatonia mixtape. But you’ll have to put Mulder and Scully. Oh, don’t worry about it. Yeah, we’re on it. I hope so. I had a thing for David, a company, because he’s just it’s difficult to be like sex addiction is a problem. Like it’s a real thing because it is. But there’s always been the idea that something appealing about David Cavani and the fact he is a beautiful person physically, he’s very Christian. I have such a crush on such a crush. It’s embarrassing.

S18: It was a big thing. I really like his nose. I love him. He’s perhaps the best. Oh, my God. Yes. No. No. My face is so hot right now.

S12: David, a company is gorgeous. Yeah. And there’s that sort of thing where you’re like, okay, if I ran into David De Cavani in a bar and was just like, do you just want to go to the bathroom? He would.

S19: Yes. Yes, I yes. What a specific lie.

S15: I know the bathroom specifically. And he would say, yes. I love I love a rich fantasy life.

S12: Yeah. Show us the show. And like, I want him to progress, like, you know, like if he has sex addiction is a problem for him. I want him to like really like just like learn and grow as a human. But there’s always been something nice about the fact that, like, if I were single and David Duchovny was in a bar, I feel like he would go in the bathroom with me goat, which is not the case for everyone. I agree.


S8: But Gillian Anderson. So from X-Files. Did you kind of follow her from, you know, her work and the things she was doing? And is there anything about her as a person as opposed to her characters that, like keeps you going?

S20: You know, even when she’s playing someone who is not a Scully?

S12: Oh, absolutely. No, the fall, obviously, she just like brought her complete A-game to it. She does a lot of interesting philanthropic work, which is always great. I love that. She’s always been very forthright about sexuality. I think she’s a great parent. And like, that’s been important to her. I love that she and David are still doing the will. They won’t. They say now. Decades later. And we all know they did what had to lie. Let’s just be real. It feels like the correct thing to have done. The first episode of The X-Files, which I remember extremely clearly because my parents went out one night a week too, and like it was a multi-level marketing scheme they were involved in, called me Ken, but they went out one night a week and The X-Files would be on. And so my little brother and I would watch it and just scare the crap out of ourselves because. And now I watch horror movies. But at the time, it was the most scary I could imagine. Yes, it really was. It was the most scary I could imagine. But there’s that first episode where she gets like a spider bite. But because she’s seen some stuff, she goes into Mulder’s motel room and she’s like, do I have like an alien implant in me? And he just sort of like lifts up her. Yeah. Her shirt and looks for it.


S21: She looks.

S22: Mulder, what are they? Mosquito bites. You sure? Yeah, I get it.

S12: I think that was such a that moment has stayed with me my entire life.

S5: What I love that you’ve kind of established with Jillian is that this is a clear case of many things, adding to the fireball of the gas stalled at the start.

S23: Julia, a good start, but ultimately, you like the minute you said, oh, she’s a good parent. I was like, yeah, that that is thus inducing in its own way. It’s nice to kind of have like all these things like layers of this built in and like altogether. Yeah, that was a good choice I made as a teenager. Yeah, I like that. So let’s let’s Segway from Miss Gillian Anderson to a character on a TV show. So this show is on Netflix. It’s currently on its second season. It’s called Mind Hunter. And the first object they’re in for you and I must say also for me is a middle aged man called Builtin Bill Tange.

S17: Let me so vill who this only happy.

S12: It’s only the second like piece of media in which I have said like wildly out of pocket things. But how hot bill touches. Go for it. Miles Claver like a metal magazine was during a like what is this thing with women being attracted to build tension? I was like, I will tell you. You know, he’s sort of my damson. He’s like, so what’s attractive about Bill tensioned? I was like, what isn’t attractive about Bill Tench? But now they’re also a lot of other things. No. So Bill Tench is like the daddy to Jonathan groff’s, like, you know, more wide eyed serial killer profiler. Right. But he’s also very open minded about new stuff, which is something I like about Bill Touch. Yeah, because Bill Touched genuinely wants to do a really good job. And like he is, you know, like he’s an FBI guy. Like, I’m not Nordin. And ordinarily, I’m not like, oh. Oh, great. Like, this is this is good. This is an era in which the FBI was doing fantastic things. But on the other hand, there were a lot of serial killers in the 70s and we needed to be paying someone government dollars to track them down. You might as well be Bill Tench. But I was like I was in it for Bill Tench from the first season where they do like the traveling music montage, where it’s like the two of them, like just driving from town to town. Yeah, I like Bill Tench is the one who can change the tire. Bill tension’s the one who can pump the gas tank is the one who never like has to swipe a second time on the subway. I have Trevor ever. He’s Bruce just knows what it’s doing. No. And he wants to be like a good husband, but he also wants not to bring all his shit home. And that’s why I like his failures as a husband are because he needs to find a way to bring some of his shit homes, which is genuine because she wants to be in a genuine marriage and he wants to be in a genuine marriage. And yet and yet he just he can’t like what he does is to like messed up to be able to have like a real relationship.


S16: I think part of the problem when someone asks what’s so it about Bill? Bill Tench, is this idea that only the beauty only comes in this one way and it has to look like this. And it has to act like this. And so when people see so many people fawning over Bill Tench like character, they don’t get it, cause he’s got this very, you know, intense military haircut, you know, just on a physical. Yeah.

S13: And then like, he’s, you know, clearly an older man who is no longer in the prime of his life as far as his body’s, you know, physicality does not know his, but his body is so tight like that lays him holding Kalani is actually he exude like a prop.. He’s very, very fit. So, again, the physicality of him is not even real. Like. Right.

S4: But he carries himself as this kind of slightly wary former athlete, kind of like, you know. But yeah, it’s exactly right. Like everything that kind of goes into him looks a bit like chin stroking. Like I. Why do I? Yeah, but it’s the song.

S12: Exactly. He used to move crates for a living like he’s played a boxer. Yeah. You can see. Yes. And it’s under it. Yeah. But I also like I like a chunky. I like some chunk. I like some big. I. And he just.

S20: He’s peak.

S24: Yeah. I like that. That’s as you she settled on one of them. Kay. He said he I love all of it. I love when.

S12: He gets more emotionally impacted by things than Holden does. Yes. You know, even though he’s supposed to be the tough guy who’s seen it all, he’s done it all like Holden is just like, oh, yeah. Tell me about how you did that with your dead mother’s head. Yeah. You know, Bill is like, I’m going to go get a coffee.


S15: Yeah. And this isn’t normal, guys. And he just kind of moonwalks out like this is too much. This is too much. What I love the thing that Nicole. Both both my lovely Nicole’s have said today is like this idea of who who Bill Tench is.

S14: I think he looks like this nineteen 60’s, 1950s, 1960s kind of square. Military man who is probably emotionally locked down and drinks too much. Drinks too much. You know has issues with like the young long-haired kids of today and whatnot. And then Bill upends all your expectations. Instead he is like this incredibly emotional, as Nicole Khalifa’s pointed out, an emotional guy who is in touch for the most part, not always, but is trying at least to access the stuff that he can’t be in touch with. He is someone who is he has this really fantastic sense of humor. He he kind of subverts the idea of him being this close minded, possibly prejudice person. And he’s kind of like, we’ll go to live on this fucking shit rock. Let’s say that is exactly that. That to me, that subversion of what is expected on what he kind of shows is it’s incredibly hot because you kind of like, oh, I didn’t know.

S15: Oh, okay. No. Okay. No, I’m in. Oh, I get that. And it’s he’s very confident, like we’ve spoken about this before, about the way how the way a man wears a watch.

S19: Wow.

S9: Of course. Of course. Stereo. You want to call it my left. Go live. Right, right. It’s all good.

S4: But like I think about Bill Tench putting on his watch in the mornings and like my back discarded, like Titan’s clumsy, like, you know.


S8: You know, it’s gonna be a very sensible watch, one that just does exactly what it needs to do. But it looks so good, you know. And he’s got beefy for. Yes.

S17: Fuck it. Bill Tench.

S12: Val, Bill, it’s just something he’s always more than you think he’s gonna be. He’s always able to make that extra step. And he’s intensely loyal, obviously. Yeah. But like I I’m just I’m always fascinated by when people on TV shows or in movies and celebrities in real life. I always wanna know if people are in real marriages or not. And by that, I mean like authentic. We are striving not necessarily on a daily basis, but on a weekly basis to be like more authentically connected to each other. And Bill 10-inch and his wife are working on that. But again, he wants to be with this woman. He wants to make this woman happy. He wants her to understand him. And he can not do that because she’s a very fragile person in many ways. And if he were to peel back like 5 percent of his day, she would come completely unglued. Which we really see in the second season.

S16: Yeah. So in the first season of Mine Hunter, it is all about Holden, Ford and learning who he is in his relationships and how he gets to this point where he becomes a profiler. But the second season is definitely all about Bill Tench and the things that he does in order to like you mentioned earlier, Nicole kind of be of the times while using his own experience to propel their work forward. And one of the things that stood out to me is in the second episode of the second season, where Bill and another police officer are talking to a victim who had been shot in the face. Oh, yeah. And the victim is in the backseat of the car and they have to. And Bill and the other officer have to face for so that they don’t look at him and cause him any discomfort or anything like that.


S25: And Bill was so empathetic, why he had to ask him some terrible questions. Soacha. But he was so gentle with it.

S3: And it was just it just it was this a moving scene. And I feel like that was maybe the best scene of the season. Agreed. Because, I mean, we never see the person in the backseat. I thought that was beautiful the way it was done because it they did a shot in the face. There are. Yeah. There’s always this thing, this moment where you think, oh, they’re finally going to show what he looks like, but they never do. So they kind of leave you on the edge of your seat as you’re anticipating the stuff. And Bill is just I know this is terrible, but I have to ask you this and it’s OK.

S26: You know, and he’s just very soothing to me. Move on again.

S27: I can barely. A radio is so loud. There was blood everywhere. I looked around for something to hit him with, but I thought. The best chance. For us to get help free around.

S28: Yeah, it’s the best thing he could’ve done. I could’ve gone back. We’d have lost you both. Kevin, thank you. If you think of anything else.

S14: I haven’t seen the second season that is making me really well, I mean, I I was so drawn to built engined the first season because like you’ve pointed out, both of you, he’s so loyal. He’s so clearly about the work. He wants to catch these bad guys. He really wants to kind of make a difference and willing to grow to do so and will grow to do so, which again, the kinkiest can get.


S24: So like I go, I’ll be bigger to do.

S13: Yeah, I you. I’m sorry. That’s how you get me. It’s done about. Are you improving yourself. Pitch like in front of my salad, ok. Yeah. It’s all the way.

S8: He’s so torn up about his relationship with his side, how to make that work and how to grow and you know how to talk to his son. It’s I mean, it’s harrowing to see him like struggle with that. But it’s also very beautiful to see that, you know, here is this father trying to be the best father he can, but he doesn’t know how I know he was.

S12: Bill was born to be a dad of like a kid he could throw a ball in the backyard with. And that’s not the kid you get because sometimes you don’t get that kid. Right. And so instead, Bill really does try to meet this kid where he’s at and he messes it up and he makes mistakes. And, I mean, you know, an autograph. Right. What we’re talking about power fans and hoof and. Well, you a French friend. I never watch French. And now I plan to watch.

S15: Oh, so listen, if you’d like OneTel in mind, Hunter. Oh, when you see her in French, something new and refreshing will be awakened in you. And I look forward to hearing about that. I will tell you, if I miss my DMZ, I open. My phone is open.

S25: I’m ready to receive. She’s. She’s so beautiful. Her suiting is so exquisite. Yeah.

S5: I always love when they put these really beautiful people in like allegedly kind of a government issued clothes. And I’m like, LOL, that’s custom.


S15: Oh, that’s not a government’s suit. Go on. No, it looks like some cheap scene from Leno. This is this is designer. And then somebody lovingly stitched it onto her body. Come on. Her blouse work is just her blouse. In fact, her and Jillian have superb blouse work. Maybe I have a blouse. Maybe I do lean in and I’ll get into it.

S12: And you can tell because there’s no gaping. Exactly. There’s no gaping.

S23: And that’s how you know, that’s the work of a seamstress on set. Yes. Every time. Every time. So we’re gonna Segway then into yet another stunt person from another TV show, also on Netflix for the time being, anyway. It’s a Jack Robinson, Miss Fisher’s murder mysteries.

S24: Yeah, I liked Jack a lot. I want to talk about. I thought he had a smile in your voice. I. Hi, guys. Welcome to my channel. I like Jack a lot. I have some things to say. So now, Nicole, tell us about him.

S25: I like a man who is trying to stay in control of his passions. And they leak out a little bit. Jack is. So he’s losing that battle with Franey Fisher. Every day, every day. Every day when she sits on his desk. And like at one point, he’s like, can you please get off of my desk? She sits on the edge of his desk while he’s in his chair and she’s turned towards him. Her body is turned toward samour. So her knees are, you know, towards him and he can see her legs. And, you know, Franey Fisher is always like, well dressed in this, like impeccable in everything that she wears. So, you know, he can’t he can’t help but look at her. And he it distracts him to the point that he’s like, you’ve got to get off my desk, you know? But of course, she ignores him. Whatever. And he’s just so buttoned up.


S3: And again, he’s trying to like hold on to the way he was raised. And times are changing. And, you know, because this is like nineteen twenties to 30.

S5: It’s the 1920s in Melbourne, Australia.

S3: Yeah. Yeah. So he’s trying to like, you know, grow and and find Fisher is helping him like move with the times.

S24: But he’s still just like, no, she’s a Mack truck.

S12: Yes. And he is like, I would prefer a bicycle.

S13: Yes. Like, she literally Kopp’s into her motorcar. And you can see him just kind of I guess, like he’s he would arrive there. He would arrive in the future anyway. But freindly kind of pushes him to get there even faster. And so he’s kind of like holding onto the edge of his seat or his hat. And he’s not he’s he’s not resisting it, but he’s resisting it because he’s like, all right, it’s fine. I’m I’m a modern guy.

S15: I’m going to and every so often he throws something into that conversation to let freind. You know that. Listen, I know you’re the one who’s lived all over the world and, you know, done all this wiss of I’m no slouch either. And every so often, Frenette will raise an eyebrow and he’ll look at her and raise one back. And I’m like, Yes, Dad, I love Jack. Like exactly what Nicole said. This this idea of a person so locked down and buttoned up.

S4: And then it’s kind of like that thing about when you when you know someone who always was the shirts buttoned all the way up and then you see them one time and it’s open at the collar. Yes. Even just one button. Even one button I kind of like this is the wildest thing I have ever seen. Yes. And that’s Jack in a nutshell. Like he’s this guy who his hair was always so gelled and he’s wearing the hat and he’s wearing his overcoat and his tie.


S10: No, it’s hot. Listen.

S5: And that that to me, like every time the first time I saw Jack kind of like he does that thing, which I I called the Bruce Willis smug because that was when it imprinted on me as in moonlighting all those years ago. And it’s that thing where the side of your mouth kind of tips up a little bit. And Jack does it a lot. Very indulgently at Franey because it’s kind of like a. What’s she like? There she goes again. Yeah. So it’s very indulgent, a very loving smile. But every so often he’ll do it.

S10: And I have to get clutch the arms of my chair, like once. It’s so hot. Right. I can’t explain it. I. Oh, my God. I’m getting tongue tied. I love Jack Robinson so much. Yeah.

S29: The review thought my performance as the major general was underwhelming. Why didn’t you let me judge for myself? I can’t remember a word of it. Oh, what rot? Once you let one of the patter songs, it’s never good. I’m more of a Shakespeare man.

S30: The stage is all yours. Age cannot with her nor custom stale her infinite variety. Other women, Cloyne the appetites they feed. But she makes hungry when most she satisfies. Perhaps a career in the theater beckons after all, Inspector.

S12: Street crime. I usually don’t read a lot of fanfiction, but that I think some of the best fan fiction out there is Jack and frightening fan fiction because we want more so badly. Yeah. No, he would not be good for us. No. Gives us the correct amount. It’s one of those rare things where the show gets it. Exactly right. Exactly right. But sometimes you just you want to see what you’re a greedy bastard. You want to. I needed it. Yeah.


S31: I like there’s an episode where someone gets killed and they are doing a radio show. And then Jack ends up, you know, being one of the voices on this show or like doing an ad or something like that. His voice is so smoky and creamy.

S3: I don’t not like. Is there?

S5: No, it’s creamy is exactly the lot. It’s basically it’s it’s somebody churning fuckin I I can’t ignore his voice. Can you imagine turning on the radio in 1920s Australia and that’s the like. Oh what’s great about it also is that it’s like this creamy thing on the radio. But when he’s when he’s speaking with funny, usually frustrated because he’s gone in gung ho or whatever, done something ridiculous, ridiculous like just pull out a pistol and shot someone, he’s going to mess up a crime scene, right? Right. She’s out there kind of like lifting stuff and picking up evidence. One of the things I really love is the way he goes, Miss Fisher.

S19: And it’s just so hot. I’m like, the minute you began calling a fry, now’s again, let’s call Miss Fisher is like, it’s up. Get it together.

S10: And you’re like, oh, yeah, right. And then she was going to look so much good. Okay. Check the way we have that little there, little back and forth isn’t so good. And it’s partly because she’s so effervescent.

S14: And in contrast, he’s so looked down and he is, again, like, you know, Nicole said he’s kind of like he’s fighting against everything. Yeah. He’s like, this is the time of conformity. Yeah. Yes. Flap, flappers, the flapping. But he’s like this police officer, like at the end of the world. Right. You know, he’s he’s heard about these modern things. He’s not a bus to them. He just isn’t necessarily ready for all of it all at once. A friend is like listening. Got time going to Dyson quick and she does everything and it’s so much for him. Yeah, but you can tell he’s also thrilled by it. He’s excited by Islamand.


S32: He’s a guy. Yeah. I you know, he’s also got some weird stuff like, you know, he’s a divorcee and he’s.

S3: Yeah. He was just wild. Right.

S31: He had like a little some tension with this Italian woman that was like on this show for like a hot second. Yeah. So we always I mean we call him as Fisher all the time with all of her, you know, rendezvous and whatever.

S24: You know, there’s always a guy there’s I have a diaphragm. Yes, she does. I got a wigs out the camera, like, you know, birth control. I’m like, all right. Friday. Right.

S3: But it’s also good to see that Jack also, you know, has a history. Has a past. Ratner and that he knows what he’s feeling. So he’s not like this virginal person, you know. But he’s just trying to, like, get his life together because he feels bad about being divorced that much. Yeah, he’s real bad about it. And he’s just. It can you can tell he’s a soft person like underneath. And I love that, too, with guys like very stern and, you know, kind of stiff. But then, you know, he melts for the right person. If you could just get him to let go a little bit. Yeah. I want to be the person that helps him like spinach.

S9: Yes. That is in a nutshell about exactly like, oh, my God. He says the things for me.

S33: Yeah, that is the stuff.

S12: Okay. So I am famously known as being a man from Uncle Obsessive. Yes. A deep and profound man. My uncle obsessive. Anytime I am on a plane, I fly Delta because that’s who my credit card is. And I live in a delta hub and they always have the man from uncle. So even though I own it on every platform, looking at it like I’m talking, I own it on YouTube, I own it on i-Tunes, I have it on Google Play like I have. Why on the hard drive of my computer, just in case like the apocalypse happens. But I also always watch it on the fly and army hammer plays. Illya Kuryakin. Yeah. KGB agent. Right. KGB agent. The top KGB agent, youngest in KGB history.


S17: Oh, my God.

S12: I really like also trying to restrain like he’s had some psychotic episode. Like he is a tightly wound dude. Is why as he is 6 foot 5. Yeah. And I’m actually I’m not like a queen at all. Neither are mine. No, not yet. I do not care at all. But if you’re 6 foot 5, you’re a fucking God. I’m sorry. Like you don’t make the rules. No, I don’t. And he’s so good looking. And his Russian accent is so intermittently bad. Yes. What a what a qualified complement, but he’s lowenstern and he’s so stern. And then the moments when he melts, like when he is warming his hands up before, like putting them up obviously of a thighs to re-attach like her, like little like listening device. Yes. Like that scene of him rubbing his hands together. I was just like, just do due diligence. Let’s let’s play that clip now. I think that’s a great plan.

S34: Your tracker is not sending a signal. You turn it on. I think so.

S35: Well, you want to check it?

S34: Be my guest. It’s it’s your record. You’re the expert. I’ll be on the balcony.

S29: Still cold, it was just so hot.

S36: What how you doing down there?

S37: That’s because I’m scared. OK.

S38: Even. Wow, I feel really hot for real, like my.

S17: No, I know, I know my eyes sweat have nothing you could do that. Not tears in my eyes or sweating. You want my fans just for a second. Yes.

S12: OK. So Henry Cavill, the American, is working for the CIA. Because he got in trouble stealing things. And they were right. Everybody knows your contract. Basically, you work for us. And Illya Kuryakin is the KGB is top guy. And they have to work together because rogue Nazis, post-World War 2, I try to get their hands on like nukes. It doesn’t matter. It’s not important at all. But so we know that Henry Cavill is a man of like taste, like he makes like a truffle risotto, like he knows about watches and stuff. Right. Like Elei, we just know is this like big meaty dude, right. Can run real fast. Yes. You can stop a car. Stop a car by grabbing the bumper. Yeah. But we don’t know that he knows about like women. Shit. All right. And then there’s a scene where Elisa of a Candar, the very beautiful Alesia of candor, who is a mechanic in East Berlin. They need to get her dressed up all fancy so she can go to Rome and see her uncle. And so Army walks in and Henry Cavill has been trying to put together an outfit for her. And Henry is that army is like, oh, no, no, no, you do not have this right at all. Yeah. And that clip is just. I didn’t know that what I wanted from a man was to know like what belt to put on that dress. Yes. He’s so angry. He’s so angry about. Like Henry Cavill attempting to dress this woman incorrectly. And I think we have to watch it. Yes.


S34: You tried to dress like someone on your side seeing someone, but it’s behind the Iron Curtain. She’s from behind the iron coat. That doesn’t mean she wants to bring it with her. We need to persis police every day. Clutch and belts. No, no, not that all. You can’t put a pack or a band belt on over two. Let’s get to work. What’s wrong with them? Two? Nothing if you’re fat. You’re gonna start a band. It won’t match.

S25: It doesn’t have to match. Yeah, that it doesn’t have to match, but he turns and he looks at Henry Cavill, who wants to die. Oh, yes.

S24: How dare you. Are you matchy matchy? Yeah. He comments of my house. My house. This is the 60s. They are exciting. Experimenting with fashion. It is.

S15: There’s something about his expression all through that movie, because this movie, generally speaking, is mostly good. Like I thought it was gonna be a bad movie. I went brace for about me and I was like, oh, I’m having fun. This is fun. Guarded.

S24: She makes very entertaining films.

S13: I mean, not always, but this he does really well. I think part of it is the chemistry between me and Henry Cavill. So my very humble erotic. Deeply, yeah, deeply. But there’s also just like on the road, like usually in a day to day circumstance, I would be more drones.

S15: Henry Kabul like I don’t necessarily fancy him, but of the two options, I’m like, that’s wild tonight. But that’s fine because I don’t really do like white hair, light eyes. I’m not really into, you know, army done, you know, generally speaking. But in this movie, the minute army have a kind of like ten of us like, well, it’s a rap like this is this is it’s for this movie in this circumstance. And then he’s everything I like. He’s like he doesn’t say many words. He like, you know, he has really good eyebrows.


S14: And again, that thing that, you know, you were saying, Nicole, about how a passionate person tamping down their feelings and trying to be even keel, trying to appear even keeled, because it’s like, you know, if I if I let this go, it’s too much. And there’s something about the way all me kind of embodies. That’s what he looks as though there are there are times when his whole face kind of gets a little bit red and you brown, what’s going to happen?

S13: Like you need therapy and the water apperently. Yeah. Like on the other hand. Oh, my God, you’re trying to hold your feelings inside. Yeah. Beautiful. Again, that hand warming scene.

S25: What I left she standing on the table and very vulnerable. Very vulnerable to do something. Very danger. Yes. But she’s standing on a table and even though he’s very tall, he she’s above him in this in this position. And he looks up at her and his eyes are thickly lashed. He has surprisingly beautiful eyes. You know, you forget about his eyes because you’re so caught up by the high body and the body. Yeah, but his really beautiful eyes, he looks up at her. And this very it’s not quite submissive. But again, he’s just like tender loving. Yeah, he’s vulnerable as well. And, you know, he tells her, you know, I’ll take care of you or whatever. And it’s just very it keeps me right where I need it to.

S20: I mean, it is just like to have this strong man be beneath me, looking up at me like a little more.

S25: Yes. And he’s nervous, too, you know, to be touching her in this way. It’s just everything that I like.


S36: It’s all about Yaz.

S3: And because Army Hammer away from the screen can be a difficult person, I base a little bit. Yeah.

S12: I didn’t know who Ollie North was. That I don’t know well enough was. So, you know, it’s a sweet summer job.

S3: Yeah. He you know, he’s done some things, I guess on Twitter, whatever. Yeah.

S31: And so just when you’re doing it like I’m through with him, I to rewatch the man from uncle because I own it and I watch it when I’m flying on the long flights, either watch the man from Uncle Psycho or Dirty Dancing to let you know what, my range isn’t great.

S25: And I oh is that that hand warming stands that just always gets me.

S4: It’s also something about the act is one of care. Like he’s trying to make sure that she’s not any more uncomfortable than she already is and has every right to be. And when she kind of flinches, when he touches her, she says it’s still cold. He looks at her with what looks like a real apology in his eyes and goes, sorry, yeah, I won’t be dog.

S12: So, yeah, just for a second. Just for a second.

S5: And that’s something I think they both know that she’s just not responding to the temperature of his hands. Right. It’s kind of more than that. She’s terrified she’s going into this, you know, mission that she’s not trained for this shit. Right. She’s being used as a pawn by these two governments. She’s terrified. She’s scared. And also she’s quite clearly drawn to this guy. And it is always a shock when your crush touches you in any way, not even necessarily in such a suggestive place. And again, stuff that should be really just kind of like dismissed a second hand, kind of like almost juvenile when he goes, you know what she does, what are you doing? And he goes trying not to get lost in if we get it close to a vagina.


S13: All right, then. But he asks her, but he makes it work. And I think that the fact that you make a cheesy line like that work and feel authentic and correct. And normal is just kind of like Jesus Christ, the skill.

S10: I’m like, it sounds like you can act on me.

S39: Oh, okay, cool.

S23: So, Nicole, you have blessed us with quite the the blueprint. If someone was to go out and look for a stone man slash a power firm. I think this is the this is the episode that’s gonna end all this searching. I got you covered. It’s been more than a pleasure to talk all the things we’d be starting with. Bill Tench, Jack Robinson, Army Hammer and the man from Uncle Gillian fucking Anderson.

S13: I mean, you’ve really covered quite a lot of the first landscape.

S12: Proud of yourself. We’ve covered a lot of ground. Yeah. I enjoyed myself.

S19: Hope you enjoy the moments where we just like. Yes, those are some good moments together. I was very surprised at myself because I feel like you do this a lot. But we got lucky.

S9: This was like the most sexual sounds I’ve ever made on air. I don’t know what we’re going to do with that, but rather, I was looking at you. I felt like I felt like you were at the first day of kindergarten. I think, oh, that’s my baby. And I’m proud of it.

S5: But anyway, Nicole, thank you so much for coming in. We appreciate it. They appreciate you. We’re so glad that this was the week that it all worked out.

S24: I know you’ve been fantastic.


S5: Can you tell people lovely things? Buckets. I’m beyond. Where can they find you on your glorious mind?

S12: Absolutely. So I spend most of my time on Twitter. I mean, literally most of my day. I am Nicole Underscore Cliffe with an E on the end and please read and enjoy Slate’s delightful parenting column. Karen Feting, which is me on Mondays and Fridays. And then I have a wonderful cast of colleagues who do all the other days because what people ultimately want is advice, right? You can never go wrong in this industry. Giving people advice. All right. They won’t take it, but other people enjoy it. And that’s that’s why it’s so good. And you also sometimes appear on Dear Prudence. Right. That’s true. I have done. I do. Dear pretty live shows. And if you are a slate plus member once a week. Danny and I do an extremely like messy, like live chat about a given letter that week in which we say all the stuff that, you know, you would never write in response to this person. We’re just like, oh, this bitch shot at them like that, this person. So I do encourage you to explore that, not the interest of you. I have had the best time. That’s woman. Glad you’re here. It’s been so much fun.

S15: You have been better than now. Our wildest dreams in terms of who could be our first guest on this run of episodes. So thank you so much. You are a constant delight and a thirsty queen. I’m a bucket of.

S36: Got it. Thank you. It was wonderful to be here.

S5: Ladies, thank you to Nicole Cliffe, who was every thirsty dream and more. I love her so much. She’s. She’s just unrelentingly great.


S4: And now we’re going to do a couple of dribbles and a longstanding segment, fanfic goals.

S23: And, you know, we have quite the smorgasbord to pick from this week in terms of us than men.

S8: I know. I know. I think it’s no secret that I have chosen Jack from Miss Phishers.

S9: I’ve chosen him to sort of predictable.

S8: I mean, you know, as you say, what the food wants. That’s very true.

S9: Very, very true. I’m excited to hear yours this week. Oh, OK. I don’t know. I mean, that we know pressure because, you know, how much pressure can a person actually hold? It’s always pressure. Okay.

S1: Well, I do my best to remove that pressure for you. I look forward to hearing what you are what you’ve come up with this week. Oh, my goodness. Okay. Well, let me just get into it. That’s what he said.

S20: I cover his glass with my hand and shake my head at the bartender who moves onto other customers. Jack. I say real softly in his ear. Honey, she’s gone. He turns blurry eyes to me. I can’t tell if they shine with tears. A cheap whiskey, a little of column, a a little of column B, maybe. She’ll come back, he says unsteadily, leaning into me like a kitten full of milk, darlin. If you really thought that you’d keep yourself sharp and not be in here, scare my customers with your vampire eyes and funny voice. You like the way I sound, don’t you? Oh, honey, you know I do. I lay a hand against the stubble that burns me in all the right places. He leans into my palm. You’re better than I deserve. He whispers, eyes clearing. My smile is a little weak as I pull him away from the bar. Come on, baby. Let me help you. Get rid of that poison running through your veins. Disgusting. I just. I don’t know why.


S9: I don’t know. There was too much Grantchester. You know, a sexy vicar. I just see. You know, Jack trying to get over Franey and me helping him. Oh, show how selfless of you. Yeah. You look like she was the fucking U.N.. I’m going to help them. I’m going to deliver some aid. Is that what you’re going to do?

S3: And I’m also just like at this point in my dating life the last few years where it seems like I keep getting these situations, ships started with men who are just coming out of some kind of long term relationship. And I have to, like baby them back into society. I don’t know.

S18: I guess it’s just and I’m tired of it. But, you know, sometimes I do recognize it could make a good story. There you go. Look at that old copy. She said, well, that was a lovely, lovely drabble. Thank you. I was. I was moved. Jackie Robinson.

S7: I’m ready to hear what you have to offer today.

S4: I got that much, to be honest, but I’m excited because it’s rare when we have a huge selection that we both settle on the same person. This is true. This is I love one when we both have a very singular thirsts.

S18: We weren’t gonna get the rest of the field is great. But this guy, this woman, your voice is gonna drop three octaves. That’s the shit. I’m glad that we both settled our gaze, our thirsty gaze on Jack this week. Mine’s a little bit longer and I again apologize. I’m trying to kind of pull back a note. Right. You know, entire novellas. But let’s go.


S1: The waves crash gently in the late morning, lazy as our intentions for the rest of the day. Jack had arrived again a day ago. The previous week. He’d had to get back to the city after just a couple of days because of a late call from the boss, a relaxing break sorted by work, not for the first time. Now, he was sitting on the lip of the bathtub while he was head bent as I tried to dress his little wound. He hissed when I wiped his hand with the antiseptic laced cloth, the little line between his eyes deepening. Oh, stop it, I said, with no bite in my tone. It’s just rubbing. Alcohol still stings, he grumbled. I looked down at his face and saw he was almost pouting. Really? I said, bending slightly to nudge his knee with mine and smoothing my foam on that full head crease. It’s not my fault. Your clumsy. I was trying to be nice and make you French toast, he said. Eyebrows raised pointedly. Why the hell is your bread knife so sharp? I raised my eyebrows right back at him because it’s a knife. I finished putting a plaster over his hand before raising it to my mouth for a kiss. He let me smiling faintly when I called it a booboo before nudging his head into my stomach, burrowing until I threw my head back and laughed. I come to my hands through his hair, pulling his face up. His gaze was wide open, soft at last. You’re clumsy, I said. And he let me pull him up by the shoulders. He leaned into GNIP, the side of my neck. But at least your heart? I said.

S40: Good old J.


S9: J. Lo Boothville on his hand.

S12: Also, look at us both taking care of him.

S32: It’s a very different way. Let’s just be like, you know, you need some help. This is why you like someone.

S18: You want to do shit for them. Exactly right. And that’s what many people don’t understand. I didn’t do that for everybody. I could for maybe five or six people at any given time. And if you’re not in the list, get the hell out. Same Jack is very much on the line. Oh, my goodness. He gets. You know, you take him up from the bomb and then, you know, my dress, his wounds. It’s all good. It’s golden. Shout out to everyone.

S19: It’s called teamwork makes the dream work.

S9: Can you imagine? I’d rather light sources get them on the weekend.

S18: This is disgusting. I love it. Oh, God. Nicole. Are all right. But you know what? We have something special today. Tell me more.

S8: You know, we have been getting some lovely dry apples from our listeners. Yes. And today we’re going to read one of them. Oh, we’ll. Yeah. Nice. I’m excited about this one because it’s so Swede’s.

S13: Oh, I love a sweet dry. Well, you know, I love the sweet Javal.

S36: This is from by Sherer, who has been just a fantastic live tweeter of episodes like she.

S25: We see you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Bye, Cher.

S31: You’re incredible.

S1: And so we’re going to we’re going to read your travel. Who’s it about Nicole? Oh, yeah.

S9: I should say this Drabble is about the big daddy.


S25: Oh, that one.

S24: But I’m also into it. Go on.

S5: Winston, do listen. The man with the thighs that you can build a future on. Boy.

S38: He recently put up a picture of him on a stallion, a literal stallion in the water on the beach.

S36: Yeah, I saw that photo. I don’t know.

S3: All my friends were sharing it just like you have seen it before. But here I go again.

S24: I.

S5: My mouth my mouth felt dry like I was like, this is ironic. Look, he’s he’s he’s in quite high water on this horse.

S41: Yeah. Yeah, I am. And he looks at the camera like I know I’m wearing short shorts. Yes, I am. And you’re like, you know what, Winston? Winnie, I appreciate that. I do. Shout out to him and his thighs and just, you know, shout out to that horse. That is a device like. No.

S24: I mean, you know, just shot out so that we know that horses are strong animals. Yeah. Yes, they are.

S36: And Tippi Carrion, that mountain of a man. Yeah. God bless.

S18: God bless you. Shout out to domesticated animals. I really did our job. Humanity. Good job. OK.

S19: So I buy shares also.

S36: All right.

S7: One, two, four. Winston said, purposefully miscounting to cause a chipper giggle and a no daddy. Three is next to come from Zorah. She hides behind the still sloshing washing machine. Ten. Ready or not, here I come. He says, is he pantomimes being a lumbering giant, arms outstretched and legs raising to his size as he feigns looking for our daughter? This is my favorite part of a Sunday afternoon, watching the two of them still in their pajamas, playing hide and seek. Winston looking under the kitchen table, inside the hall closet, behind the couch, as if he can’t hear a muffled giggling. Soon he will sit on the couch with a thud by spread wide, with his elbows touching his knees and his hands cupping his face to say, I just can’t find Zorah where aware could she have gone? And she will come running out to him and lands in his lap to tell him her newest hiding spot.


S23: Well, I will smile watching what all our love has made us by sheer lyssa beautiful whole Sunday afternoon activity.

S19: You know, we love Daddy’s in daddy’s small part of my life every single time. But she’s not real sure.

S41: I just I love to imagine a beautiful black man, you know?

S9: And Zora is up for Neale Hurston. Sea level level blackness.. Levels of thirst, levels of black.

S18: This is just all here is. And complete package. Wow. Well, you know, be like my sheriff. Send us your own show and affecting gravel. That makes us giggle like fucking teenagers.

S23: The email address is first aid kit at Slate dot com and perhaps we’ll read it out on air. So please include your pronouns.

S8: Thank you very much. Thank you. And don’t forget Friday we’re gonna put up the poll so that you can vote for which of our drabble is that you like the best when I can include buy shares because I think she would, you know, wipe the floor with us. And this is our show. So sorry.

S19: You thought by share you.

S11: So on Friday, after this episode goes out, let us know if you like Jack Robinson trying to get over a lost love or, you know, some tender love in first aid.

S18: I appreciate your call is never not working. I thank you for that. Thanks. That’s gonna be on our Twitter. That is at first aid kit.

S1: And yeah. Vote for what, Muji?

S5: But as we always say, nobody loses here. Exactly. So just come ready to first and really put your back into it.

S2: Yeah.

S26: Thursday Kids is a slate production produced by Chef Vincent and US Bill Murray, when me and Nicole Perkins, the senior managing producer Slate podcast is Jean Thomas and the editorial director is Gabriel Bros. Music is by Tanya move-in. You can follow the show on Twitter at first aid kit and where Tennessee Whiskey Woman That’s t n whiskey with an E. Woman and Bill do. We’re also on Tumblr where you can find more details, show notes and all kinds of wonderful little images. Here are my personal favorites at Thursday Kitteh podcast, dot tumblr, dot com. You know, you can ask questions there and we may even answer. Our guest, Nicole Cliff, is on Twitter at Nicole Underscore. Cliff, that’s Cliff with an E! And you can read and sending your questions to her and her colleagues at the Care and Feeding Parents column on Slate dot com. If you live, tweet your lesson. Please use the hashtag pod pod and you can also send us emails. We would love to read your own travels as long as they’re short. Please keep them short. And we might even read yours out on the show. Please include your pronouns when you send them to Thursday here at And we know we ask this every single episode. But ratings and reviews really do help us out. If you like what you hear, please go to Apple podcasts and leave us, you know, five stars. Also, a review that never goes amiss. It helps other people find us. And also, it does this really great thing of making us look amazing. Thank you. Continue to thirst with vim and vigor, as Ben says. But do it responsibly and see you next time.

S12: By the way, randomly, I have thought so much about Belltown shooting pussy and just the fact that I think that he wouldn’t know what it was like. You’d have to be like, this is a thing you can do, but it anyway.

S15: Yes. Like, you just. You know what I how I know he’d be great as it genuinely the width of his shoulder.

S24: Yes. Like your ex would be your heel.

S17: I know he would be in like in so deep up and shit.